It’s Grinderman! Better not tell Nick Cave.
1 Like
Hi Peder, I use a Lumin P1 as my streamer. It has the option of regular Ethernet or fibre input. They also recommend using single mode fibre cable over multi mode. That is what I am using right now, so I would like to know exactly what your friend is grinding on the cable?
I am also a machinist, so have a lot of experience and tools/machines to grind or polish anything I want to. Maybe it would make a difference, I don’t know, but I am the type that likes to try things for myself before I brush it off as nonsense.
For example, back in the 90’s I owned a Seadoo, and I took off the impeller so I could polish it at work. I gained almost 5 mph top speed by doing this. Here is the fibre cable I use, where do I grind it?
2 Likes
NO,.I come from the same knowledgeable side of the Hifi-interest as, for example…
• @Blackmorec
• @Darkebear
…and a number of others.
Your comment about Peter Belt only embarrasses yourself,.but I’m not surprised…
I believe it is the process in fibre installs where the length of the fibre cable is determined then cut then the ends are smoothed off with a machine presumably through grinding.
The argument here for Ethernet has been that they ‘sound’ different because of interference over the wire. The argument for fibre is that interference is eliminated.
Therefore to claim that just making the ends a bit shinier makes it sound better brings us back to ones and naughts somehow change down the wire.
Some (very few) will believe this to be true.
The machines to do the grinding are not cheap
1 Like
tut tut DG, nobody uses SC connectors anymore, that is so last century - LC is where it is at these days.
KW (40 years data networking professional - particularly in fibre networking, and reading this thread with a certain amount of amusement)
1 Like
Actually, for some of us fiber-nauts it’s DAC (direct attached cable) that has replaced AOC (best sounding fiber imo). If going with a DAC cable Amphenol Skewclear is best sounding for off the shelf (Melco also make their $$$ version). The cable should only be used as a last leg though (in my case opticalModule to optcalRendu. DAC cables bring the bass as well (firm but with presence) compared to fiber optic. A lot less heat with DAC cables as well - my opticalModule runs cold compared to when it had an optical SFP cage in it.
1 Like
That may be so and so am I.
But for £25 I’m not complaining.
DG…
1 Like
Hi 
…
It is noticeable from your statements that you have no experience or knowledge about this.
As my friend says who has been exploring this for almost five years,.the last two years with support from the company, when the results have been so successful…
“Yesterday’s truths,.are tomorrow’s mental prison”
Incidentally,.he collaborates in this with the highly meritorious FS lab in Germany.
It is one of their engineers (female) who performs these 4-step grinds.
This black military-spec singlemode cable is made in different lengths,.so it’s not something you sit and “grind yourself”.
We are NOT “very few”,.who have heard the difference in Sweden 
.
I say as Linn’s famous statement…
Just Listen,.As Simply As That.!
Otherwise,.Enough Said…!!
PS: A little tip @garyi ,.in all my years on this forum, I’ve only seen you mocking and ridiculing other members’ practical experiences and knowledge they’ve shared.
INSTEAD,.take and share your possible knowledge of practical advice, on how to improve the soundquality of music- systems.
2 Likes
You can work since 70 years in the fiber optic and know however a little in its application in audio. It’s not the same.
5 Likes
Actually I am about 50% cold hard sceptic and 50% useless advice.
Allow me however to advise on how to make your hifi sound better. Sort your room treatment out. No need to go out grinding, just sort out your room.
Is you room sorted out peder?
It’s shame to two you cannot be civil to each other ! It gets very boring to see you slagging each other off and points scoring
2 Likes
Hi …
The first time already around 1983,.it took a year to get it optimal…
And in all homes since then.
That,.and running dedicated electricity to the music-system is the first thing I do when moving house.
1 Like
I promised you an update on my use of the media converter kit.
Having used it a while, I must say that I’m extremely happy with the improvement that it has made.
Since we last chatted, there have been a few, but not significant changes;
- Changed the Fibre Patch Lead to the OM1 spec
- Changed over the two supplied SMPS power supplies to two iFI iPower2 SMPS power supplies
- Re-routed the cables to separate the power cables from the data cables to improve the isolation
These added no further significant improvement, but the OM1 is now the correct spec and the power supplies are technically better but also better looking.
Overall I’m very happy with the improvements for a modest outlay, (Media converter kit off eBay £25 / OM1 Fibre Patch Lead £3 / iFI iPower2 SMPS x2 £140). The music has become more detailed and more relaxed, not as loud as it initially was, down about 5/100, so now playing at average volume level of 55 instead of 50. However, by turning it up that extra 5/100 gave you that more detail with a nice amount of supporting bass.
Given that we listen to Jazz, this has been most beneficial.
I’m sure that we could change the power supplies, which may bring about further improvements, but with further cost. At the end of the day, a big improvement for little effort and cost.
DG…
9 Likes
Very neat job there DG. Good to try these things for yourself and see if it works for you. 
3 Likes
Indeed fibre is all very well in Ethernet connections, its biggest downside for audio is that it is microphonic and introduces serialisation phase noise in the connection in response to sound pressure… and phase noise/clock jitter can cause digital coupling noise into transport modules unless these are carefully decoupled.
Interestingly this aspect of fibre is used in covert surveillance as well as oil/gas pipeline tampering detection systems… bit of long way perhaps from hifi, but I mention as it is clearly understood and recognised property of network fibre types.
But fibre will defo eliminate common mode leakage currents from passing from lesser electrically clean components… so you choose your poison.
3 Likes
I spent half a decade in a covert surveillance unit in US Law Enforcement. You’re 100% correct.
3 Likes
Yes, their posts are highly amusing and entertaining. 
, some sort of modern versions of Peter Belt’s stories.
1 Like
Hi 
…
Whaoo..
…
WELL,.if you think so, about the know-how in installation and optimization of music-systems that…
• @Darkebear
• @Blackmorec
..exhibits…
It makes me think that you don’t know much about installing and optimizing top level music-systems.
Something that I myself have done on behalf of other private individuals for decades around Sweden.
AND,.everyone so far has been incredibly happy with my work in making their music-system “sing”.
BUT,.please tell us about what you prioritize when you install and optimize a music-system, to achieve the best possible sound quality.?
Cheers…
/Peder
1 Like
Hmm, that a bit of a sweeping statement to make. I suspect on this forum there are well healed enthusiasts who have accrued their personal experiences, and professional sound engineers who have qualified in college and who make a living on providing excellent solutions for the music industry. I have no idea whether @sean86 falls into either… but perhaps not entirely relevant.
I suspect (well in my experience they do) these groups of people tend to use very different language, methods and approaches… one more artisan and the other more professional, deterministic and music industry aligned… however both will likely have the same target of making and setting up systems to provide the best outcome for the given budget. From a personal perspective I find the artisan language often a bit fanciful and speculative… and yes I do chuckle to my self sometimes, unless I believe it’s misleading and I then post… part of the value of a community.
So yes the language and approaches by one group may look funny and entertaining to the other group and vice versa… but one shouldn’t assume one approach is automatically better than the other… but if you had to make a choice I would side with the approach behind much of the music we hear on our systems.
4 Likes
@Simon-in-Suffolk
Hi …
It’s getting a little hard to read your posts.
Now I’ve had to reread it four times, when you changed it four times…
It will be a bit time consuming .