Silly question right? But bare with me if you would….
I love our system of Moon 260D CD transport / Qutest DAC / Moon 340ix amp and Klipsch Forte III speakers. It gives an outstandingly vivid impression of real musicians being in the room, more so than anything else I’ve ever heard. I put this down to the Klipsch speakers which are horn loaded in the mid and HF and horns are renowned for this effect. It’s not perfect by a long way, but real sounding - definitely yes.
Still, I sometimes find myself hankering after something more domesticated. By which I mean something less full-on, smaller scale and bizarrely perhaps, less real. I sometimes think that attempting to create the sound of a rock band or orchestra in a typical domestic setting is a bit of a folly. Rather one should perhaps aim for a small scale less imposing representation of the real thing, but one that retains all the musical excitement and message.
I could liken it to when we had a projector, around 20 years ago now. It was great fun and very impressive watching movies like this. But I found it too full-on in the end. I didn’t really want to be in a cinema every night watching movies, I wanted to relax into the smaller scale more domesticated viewing that one gets from a TV (remember typical TV’s were somewhat smaller then!).
What are people’s thoughts on this? What are you aiming for with your system? Do you aim to recreate reality or to just convey the musical message on a smaller scale?
I want a system that just makes me listen to music i.s.o. constantly analyzing what I hear and thinking of improvements. I just want to enjoy the music and the emotions it triggers. Reality is watching artists play life and not re-production on a HiFi system. Every HiFi system will sound different. Every headphone will sound different. Every room will sound different.
After going through a whirlwind of system upgrades in very short order, I am now content. I am relearning how to just enjoy music, which for me, is quite an adjustment. I want my system to bring the emotions and PRAT of music into our space. A great system can engage one while forgetting audiophile aspects. However, no system can fully approach live music in a great acoustical space.
Someone once put this elegantly: I don’t want a system that brings the musicians into my room but one that puts me in their room. I couldn’t agree more. DGP
Thanks Pete again you raise great topics. I’m on the road to ‘musicians in the room’ as I was still impressed that I heard Norah Jones in the room with Naim system owned by a fellow, yet the sound is natural, warm and non-fatiguing. But I’m also like you, thinking on a tiring day I just want some easy sound/music, and a decent Nait 2 would do.
On a good system that works in your own room for your own tastes, does the volume control not provide the option to move from a domesticated sound at low levels all the way up to the musicians in the room?
With that variability, the system allows us to enjoy our music library to its fullest?
I also have added my HiFi system via a Sonos Port to various rooms (kitchen, master bedroom, outside terrace) each with their own amplifier and speakers to allow for domesticated listening in different areas.
You raise a good point. On the face of it - yes of course. However I find that playing a system that sounds so real at low volumes just sounds wrong to my ears. I feel compelled to listen at realistic levels (of course they’re not really realistic but you get what I mean hopefully). This is where I think small speakers really come into their own. One can play at much lower levels without it sounding odd, since it’s not really trying to emulate reality.
I finally decided on Naim because of the live sound. To have a ‘smaller’ sounding system would probably bore me to death. Careful what you wish for. Perhaps stick an Alexa thingy for those moments?
My wife uses a little Denon Micro System an awful lot in our kitchen so that she can enjoy music whilst cooking. It doesn’t sound anything like real musicians but it sure is highly entertaining to listen to.
“People make an awful lot of fuss nowadays, don’t they, about the quality of the sound they listen to, have you noticed? They spend all that time trying to get the exact effect of an orchestra actually playing in their sitting room. Personally, I can’t think of anything I should hate more than to have an orchestra actually playing in my sitting room.”
What I want and get from a hi-fi system is of course music playing and sounding good at home. That absolutely means the music in its entirety, without diminishing the bass end, something that seems all too common in many systems. Then the more natural it sounds the better: by that I I mean sounding as close to the real thing as possible. The question that is what is the real thing?! for me most commonly that would be sitting in a comfortable seat with a good view of the musicians, for a solo artist or small band /ensemble maybe just 10 feet away, for a big rock band it could be 10-20 rows back in medium sized auditorium, for a full orchestra or opera it could be centre front of the grand circle or similar position in well tiered stalls, etc. in all cases with a silent attentive audience and amplified a good and well mixed PA system.
Then there are variations I play with, e.g. if I want to feel that I am standing close to this stage with a rock band at full pelt I might simply wind the volume up to realistic level and perhaps move more between the speakers, etc. The key I think is a system that is as mutual as possible covering the entire frequency range, provided that the recording is good enough, then, as @Brian suggest, the volume control is what makes the difference between being Live sounding or more gentle background.
Your movie analogy is an interesting one:. I have often said that the perfect TV screen would be one that you could vary in size at Will, from a smallish screen that presents, say, newscasters’ faces life size, and then something a bit larger for many TV programs and perhaps casual films, to full scale massive screen for movie watching. I achieve it by having a projector with very large screen, and they normal sized TV, in different rooms, when I want the grand movie experience we used to projector dim the lights etc, and at other times watch on the TV. Some people have more than one system, and other people sometimes swap components like, in particular, speakers to give them changes like that with hi-fi. I find the volume control perfectly adequate!
Great topic again I can only one thing, connection with what is being played that keeps me in my seat, and the encouragement to explore different music.
Can’t say anymore than that really, have added 3 x Power Line Lite and Hi Line to source to pre amp and have more of the above!
Absolutely! Even having a string quartet playing in my lounge I imagine would be fairly oppressive. And a rock band like XTC (who I love) would just be unbearable!
Thanks for your considered and detailed reply @Innocent_Bystander Regarding the movie analogy, we now have a 48” TV which, whilst large by old-fashioned standards is quite small by modern standards for the main viewing TV in the lounge. We are perhaps (definitely!) atypical in our viewing habits in that the TV is used solely as a monitor for watching DVD’s and Blu Rays (including some 4K’s). We (especially me) like a lot of older TV material from the 70’s (The Professionals, The Sweeney, Thriller etc. etc.) Some of this material is only available on DVD and image quality is quite ropey. Going too big screen-wise simply makes it look worse. So it’s a balance between this and making the most of newer HD or UHD material. But I don’t think I’d really want to go much bigger than 48’ for a TV. To me it seems a sensible size for our lounge. I don’t want a massive screen where we’ll be turning our heads from side to side to follow the action.
If we had the room, finances and if I could be bothered the ideal would be a home cinema room with projector for movies, a concert room with large speakers for enjoying music at concert type levels and a normal size TV (as now) in the lounge with a music system with smaller speakers (LS3/5a size) for casual and background music listening. Even if we had the room/money though I don’t honestly think I would bother. I think you’re right (as @Brian ) - I should just get used to using the volume control.
A question that is more difficult to answer than it seems.
I mostly use headphones, as listening to music at high levels is not possible, as I live in an apartment. Also my wife cannot stand my “at the limit” tastes in Jazz. My HiFi with speakers has to fit into our living room.
I am looking for a system that gives a good approximation of what I hear when I go to a concert. I mostly listen to Jazz, so extreme heavy bass, is not essential as it is in some genres.
With my CD/Steamer attached to a SPL Phonitor SE, and with a choice of Senheisser HD800S, Heddphone GT2 or Beyerdynamic T1v2, I have reached the point, where spending more money would gain me very little, if anything.
My Naim XS3 with PMC bookshelf speakers, in the living room, whilst not at a level reached by many here, lets me enjoy music too. It is at a level where music sounds good.
That’s exactly what I want. My large Klipsch speakers, being horn loaded, give me that. They produce a sound with a very live feel, being tactile, fast and immediate sounding and effectively mimicking the sound of live instruments very well. However I suspect that many people don’t want this. They want something that conveys as accurately as possible what’s on the recording. And that is quite a different matter and requires a system/speakers with somewhat different qualities to mine.