Why ? It’s a Return for Forever album, with Stanley Clarke on electric bass, Chick Corea on keyboards, Airto Moreira on percussions…
It’s completely a jazz samba fusion album, IMO.
But we may disagree on the genre. On your list, you have Soft Machine and Colosseum. For me it’s not jazz fusion, more Rock jazz, Progressive Rock.
I’m not sure of a distinction between jazz-rock and rock-jazz (a description I wasn’t particularly aware of), but the boundary between progressive rock and jazz-rock fusion is very muddy and blurred. That being said, I would never describe Yes, Genesis, Tull etc. as jazz-rock; likewise I don’t think Miles ever ventured into progressive rock. However, I think Soft Machine have drifted into both camps, but Fourth, Bundles, Softs and Hidden Details are most certainly fusion albums to my mind.
For me Soft Machine is more progressive, psychedelic rock than jazz. More rock than jazz. But I am aware it’s sometimes qualified as Jazz fusion.
In my mind and understanding of jazz rock/ fusion, the musicians were mostly playing jazz before, or in the meantime. They are issued generally from jazz, at least for the leaders.
And after they could choose some musicians in other genres of music, like for example Herbie Hancock who invited funk musicians as Paul Jackson or Wah Wah Watson.
I personally added Brian Auger in my above list, but will not qualify that group, in absolute terms, as Jazz fusion group, more Rock group playing, on some tracks, jazz fusion.
Surprised there are no votes for Tony Williams Lifetime Emergency! Simply the heaviest of all fusion albums.
Here a list of Digitaldreamdoor site. Their 100 best.
I just deleted my post so.
Sorry for getting back late.
These labels are just convenient buckets where we put music, for want of a way to define and categorize it. It is artificial and incorrect as music does not fit into buckets. There are no distinct cut-offs between one genre and another; it’s a continuum and we chose, for convenience, to draw an arbitrary line and say the stuff on the left fits in this bucket and the stuff on the right fits in that bucket.
You’re free to call it whatever you want. Most jazz standards were called pop music back in the 30s-40s, many wouldn’t consider that anything Miles Davis did as of In A Silent Way can be called jazz, at the time, most musicians didn’t call whatever Bird, Dizzy, Monk et al were doing as jazz.
In my book, and that is my opinion withe way I draw the lines and define the buckets, Light as a feather is a latin-jazz album but not a jazz-rock album. I wouldn’t call it samba-jazz either. For that you can go to Sergio Mendes and Brazil 66 as a prime example. Return to Forever did become a Jazz-rock/fusion outfit as of the subsequent album (Hymn to the 7th Galaxy). But the way, Stanley Clarke plays mostly acoustic bass on Light as a Feather and the 1st album. He switched fully to electric afterwards.
Soft machine started as a Canterbury band (there’s another bucket) or progressive quirky rock and with time became a jazz-rock band. Basically, anything after their 4th album is firmly into fusion territory (including the Bundles that I suggested and the Softs that someone else did). You should listen to those albums. Btw, Gong also started as a weird Canterbury band and morphed into a fusion outfit, basically starting with YOU (iirc).
Colosseum is definitely not a rock band. Hiseman was a jazz drummer, Richard Heckstall-Smith was a jazz sax player. They melded jazz and rock. Same can be said of If (and others).
Also, in my book, there is no difference between jazz-rock and rock-jazz. You’re free to think of it differently (jazzed-up rock vs rocked-up jazz ) but that’s a bit too much for me.
Yes and Genesis are definitely NOT jazz or jazz-rock bands. You can call them progressive rock, classical rock, pompous rock, but there is practically no element of jazz in their music, Genesis prides itself on the fact that most of their solos are written, not improvised. Don’t get me wrong, I love Genesis and Yes, but it’s a long way to jazz from there.
Labels are difficult and to misquote Duke Ellington: “there are only 2 kinds of music, good music and bad music”. The rest is for librarians not music lovers.
PS I was not allowed to post Heckstall-Smith’s known name, so I went for Richard. Is this political correctness gone too far ??
Nice list - very few that I do not know or have here. I’ll look them up (Compost? Metro?)
Clearly written by a fellow Allan Holdsworth lover as he’s got quite a titles in there (he’s also on Planet X, Believe It, Wackerman’s Forty Reasons, Expresso II) and Zappa (a few titles in there, including King Kong).
Anyway, I wouldn’t put the following on a fusion list: Aja, The Low Spark of high Heeled boys, Dreasm (more of a funk album), Lotus (latin-rock in the most), BST (on the border there), Chicago (same, on the border), Light as a feather (as discussed). Hatfield is Canterbury. Michael Landau is a blues guitarist - I have a live blues album of his, but not sure it is the same one mentioned.
Anyway all fun.
[quote=“Cemil, post:50, topic:17913”]
Anyway, I wouldn’t put the following on a fusion list: Aja, The Low Spark of high Heeled boys, Dreasm (more of a funk album), Lotus (latin-rock in the most), BST (on the border there), Chicago (same, on the border), Light as a feather (as discussed). Hatfield is Canterbury. Michael Landau is a blues guitarist - I have a live blues album of his, but not sure it is the same one mentioned.
I agree at 99%….apart the album we discussed above.
My definition of jazz rock, from what I could read elsewhere in the past : Jazz rock is an evolution of the jazz after 1968/1969, a jazz that incorporates electric instruments from rock ( electric guitar and electric bass, whah whah pedals….) and other forms and cultures of music, from Africa, India, Caraïbes….( so the reason of fusion term).
For a lot of jazz aficionados, jazz ended in 1967 , with the death of Coltrane.
Not all persons think that, of course, but many many unfortunately.
Look at the jazz thread for example : > 90 % of the albums posted are from the 50’s and 60’s. For a majority, real jazz is from 50’s and 60’s.
Perhaps the reason jazz rock / fusion, is very often not considered as jazz.
So better call it jazz fusion.
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