Very cool to hear the 2 different points of view from B&W and Naim. Despite not having B&W and a kit like yours, I find the post quite interesting and useful. Thanks for sharing!
2 Likes
After an outlay of over 20k I don’t equate VERY, VERY HAPPY with feeling the bass, or anything else, is lacking.
You’ve spent more on your speakers than most spend on their system.
If my 20k outlay did not equal musical nirvana I would be very, very unhappy.
It’s all relative, isn’t it.
Decent speakers inevitably are expensive if they are capable of doing low bass well. £20k may be a (very!) significant sum, but that much new is not a huge amount for decent speakers! This is where the source first falls down, for anyone wanting the bottom octave or two uncurtailed (though personally when I auditioned the higher level 802D2 it didn’t wow me).
My experience is when people say they are missing the bottom two octaves…usually in reality they are missing good bass response down 40hz… This with careful amp/speaker matching is perfectly doable with medium size standmount speakers… Amp/speaker matching is super critical probably more so than the ultimate source…
2 Likes
It is relative. It’s also my attitude to life - I believe in the need to own my choices and treat the mistakes as learnings not mistakes.
I have today re-found my nirvana…. This is why I don’t stress - it’s mostly a waste of energy until you know where you are.
Ok so I am unsure why things have worked out but my dealer came over to help with my issue…
We unplugged everything as the system rack needed moving 90 degrees. We rewired everything and installed my mains conditioner (chord M8) which had been in London, we also put the speakers on their spikes. Turns out they were on their wheels……
Other thing I did was add the Sarum T jumper leads - I only got them today and was running on the B&Ws std jumpers.
My experience is transformed. What I had lost has come back, largely. The room is different so I still need to play.
Am currently listening to Alison Goldfrapps last album and f@@@ me…
The test track was Dire Straits telegraph road which was lack the bass last time. Whoooo hoo it’s gorgeous.
I will be investing in the Gaias based on this simple move and I am going to intro a 555ps into it all in the new year for a home demo based on what I have learned here.
12 Likes
Well, that’s a great outcome 
1 Like
The funny thing is that none of the changes made by the dealer were advised through the entire thread. But the future changes, yes.
The wheels hadn’t been mentioned… so how were we to know? Obviously they will change things.
1 Like
I didn’t know either until further inspection. I didn’t install the speakers.
By bottom octave or two I mean 20-40 or 20-80. From 80 (or somewhere between 60 and 80) down to 40 indeed is very often curtailed, sometimes considerably, in small speakers, such that people think they’re hearing bass but are primarily hearing harmonics. In addition even in larger speakers 40 down to 20-30 is not infrequently curtailed. (Drop tuning of bass guitars and double basses down to 32.7 is not uncommon, and bass pedals may go down lower.)
1 Like
Yes, a big hmmmmmm applies – and with the bigger B&Ws, they can also have driver transit pins in them too, and some (inc dealers) have overlooked their removal at set-up.
To be fair he came back to finish the install. I hadn’t realised they had wheels down.
When my dealer installed my 802d3’s he encouraged me to move the speakers on their castors before returning to put the spikes down. I did experiment but unfortunately I couldn’t achieve the recommended minimum distance of 50cm from the back wall because the speakers came too much into the room (well according to my wife) and had to settle for 46cm. The dealer also removed the castors rather than just winding them up so that the spikes could go fully down. I believe B&W recognized this problem and has given more length to the d4 spikes so the castors can probably be left in situ.
Interesting to learn about B&W’s clever built in wheel/spike approach - it is exactly what I have loosely considered designing as a modification to my MB2 stands to aid moving if/when needed.
FYI, I think Wilson have some metal/Teflon-coated(?) pads for installing their speakers, which the spikes either sit in, or they fit instead of the spikes. The 'speakers can then be moved around on carpet/rugs etc, for final positioning.
1 Like
I have managed to achieve 50 cm because of the configuration and it does help. I am going to get the Gaia isolation feet given what I am learning.
2 Likes
They are amazing and yet leaving them on casters leaves them prone to movement- they are very mobile on a solid floor…
If it sounds good with spikes leave them alone and as is.
Now is good, leave it, as more changes could make it worse.
DG…
1 Like
When I had 60kg IMF RSPMs they were fitted with castor, no others option (but made around 1970 no speakers had spikes). I had a low stand with spikes just sufficient to raise the castors off the floor (~100mm). After finding the best position I marked it, replaced the speakers with the stands, and lifted them on. (The construction of the speakers was such that there was somewhere to grip on both front and back, so surprisingly easy to do.)
1 Like