Looks like Vinyl out sold CD’s in ‘20 & ‘21🤔
Certainly the pre-loved CD market is going to rival the pre-loved Vinyl market in the next 10 years, as streaming continues to dominate going forward.
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But even if everyone who posted here saying they would buy one did, then Naim might have 20 customers. So let’s assume that there are ten times that many customers (a brave assumption I think), that’s 200 customers. To design, develop and bring to market such a new higher end CD player would cost say £2M, which I suspect is probably a gross underestimate. That’s £10K each for the fact of the player being in existence. Add £5K each for the build/test and another £5K each for marketing etc. Plus a third to cover distribution, dealer profit etc, so around £27K each so far. Add 20% for Naim profit and another 20% for VAT, that’s about £40K each.
So would those of you encouraging Naim to build a new CD player actually come up with that £40K each? I doubt it.
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Even half of that cost would require a serious bit of consideration for many. A £40k CD player is reference level cost in my opinion, which lets face it, is open to less than 10% of Audiophiles without a lottery win.
I love CD like you. That is why I am looking at a very close look to the MARANTZ SACD 30n. Probably the best of the 2 world.
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I have Linn Akurate SACD player which I’m very satisfied with. Also have a Technics CDP from 1992, which still works great.
Hello IB,
With all due respect, my post wasn’t aimed at you, but rather the general trend every time someone starts a thread on CDPs; be it to bemoan the loss of Naim selling to the high-end market, or detailing how their previously beloved CDP failed and finding a general difficult climate to make repairs, or other converging industry trends that force dedicated CD enthusiasts from forgoing new players and having to scour the second hand market.
And almost without fail, the general response from the Streaminati is to crash the thread and aver that CDP owners would do well to bury their players and large, physical collections, and run to the higher ground where salvation awaits. I think it safe to say that most CDP owners at this point know they have an option to move away from the silvery discs.
Your solution, I believe, of a Core (presumably with hard drive, to keep the box count lower) and streamer is a sensible solution. But for many, including me, our preference is to retain the tactile and emotional feel of inserting a disc into an integrated player and hitting play. Add a PSU to upgrade performance, and you’ve maxed out at 2 boxes. Quite elegant.
As we have seen with turntable technology, Naim (mostly) exiting from the market has nothing to do with being unable to extract ever greater performance from the medium. DR tech, better DAC chipsets, etc., all could have led to better performance with future model releases.
Perhaps at some point, some pioneering group will make a business specializing in the maintenance and modification of older Naim CDPs. I wish they would.
I also wish the dedicated forum enthusiasts who wish to rekindle their passion for their cherished hobby can do so without being reminded, every 10-15 posts, that another option exists.
Cheers,
OA
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Should be interesting to find the related stats. But you have to consider the total owners of CD players vs streamers today.
The cd’s go on for ever but most of the players will be on the scrap heap. For someone starting in hifi today streaming makes a lot of sense but you can start a cd collection very cheaply. Vinyl is much more expensive even if the ultimate sound may be superior. Out of interest I occasionally look up the price of a cd in Discogs. Just Another Diamond Day is about £14 on cd which is what I paid 25 years ago. The original vinyl from 1970 is between £2000 to £3000! (Later reissues are approximately £35). Clearly an unusual example but my very laboured point is that starting a large vinyl collection today will be expensive but cd will be affordable.
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I agree , but for me, buying an album from the analog era on cd doesn’t make sense. The album sounds so much better on lp.
If your music is from 1985 to nowadays, then a CD player can be an alternative solution to the streamer.
The reason I have a turntable to listen to albums from the 60’s to around mid 80’s and a streamer ( previously a Cdx2/xps2) to the music produced in the 90’s to nowadays.
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It would be interesting to compare those who owns a decent music playback system. I.e. subtract phones, pads and computers from the streaming numbers.
A CD is just a physical distribution format. I buy CDs and rip but I buy an increasing number of downloads from Beatcamp despite downloads losing market share much faster than physical media.
One should also remember that CD has a better system paying artists on manufacture rather than at sales point. So you have the CD sales outside of the control of RIAA and their international friends at concerts, local stores etc.
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What do you mean by “downloads loosing market share “?
Thanks FR. You have hit the nail on the head. From the mid 80’s to about 2010 there was a vast amount of classical cd’s produced. Many of the best versions of sonatas, concertos and symphonies were only available in cd. A lot of period instrument music only really started in the 80’s and mostly only on cd or sacd. Of course this music can be streamed but I found at my dealer that some of my favourites such as some more obscure recordings were not available to download so you would have to rip them and double up on equipment which I am trying to avoid for cost reasons!
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Nobody downloads stuff any more, they just stream it. That’s what the statistics show. OK, a few diehards like us still download albums, but we are a commercially insignificant part of the overall market. How many youngsters do you know who store music on their phone?
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I as going that way with streaming Qobuz thinking yes this is all I need. Then we had several prolonged outages with Virgin media……
my then Uniti Core saved the day. I then went on to buy my Melco and do direct downloads……but my daughter just listens on the fly.
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And there are still big gaps in the streaming services’ catalogues, including record labels who do not allow any streaming of their material at all. Hyperion, which makes up a significant proportion of my personal collection, is an example. A good many of my favourite folk/world albums are also missing from Qobuz.
Roger
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Mine never listens.
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When listening to MY music, my daughter would rather listen to the fly.
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My daughter and her partner were in my house yesterday and spent time playing Jeff Beck and Miles Davis on vinyl.
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Good girl👍🏼
Indeed, I have an F2 of similar vintage and use it most weeks, faultless!!
I also have an original F which dates from the early sixties, I use it less, but works fine.
I discovered an old Sieko automatic that I have not worn in 30 years. Strapped it on and it’s accurate to plus / minus 5 secs per day
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