Oh, regarding ripping. Try using iTunes and rip to ALAC (and replay as ALAC). For some reason it sounds really good. I have not been able to figure out why yet. ALAC also sound better than FLAC (for me!!).
Firstly, you put the speakers in to the ideal position and record that position in the Linn application, then you move them to the practical position and record that position. You record environmental and room construction factors too. There are quite a few parameters to enter. You then download the configuration it creates on to your DSM. The configuration is speaker model specific.
It does a brilliant job for me in my lounge. With V1 I could read the parametric equalisation settings and in my case it applied cuts in the bass. I thought it went a little above 80 Hz, but I am now using V2, which keeps these settings to itself. V1 worked well, V2 works considerably better for me: perhaps because I had expert help from Linn specialists.
It adapts to my lounge really well and as a result when fed by my LP12 Urika II gives me the best sound I’ve ever achieved at home from vinyl replay. Without SO, it isn’t as musical (subjective opinion), but not bad either: on a par with the Naim system I had 10 hears ago.
Oh, get me wrong. Linn Space Optimization seems very well designed and the best way to do it.
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Really?
In my opinion. Leaving the midrange untouched is very smart. If I had SO I would probably use it, at least try it.
I just tried some files ripped to ALAC with JRiver last night. Possibly be even better sounding than those ripped by iTunes. I’ll investigate this closer in the coming weeks.
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I have tried using DSP in three ways, the first two caused more loss from the music than they returned in gains, the last approach is the only one I still use.
1 Using a realtime DSP system.
This took away too much vitality and subtlety from the music compared to direct SPdif replay
Abandoned.
2 Modifying the files and increasing to 24/192 resolution. Just changing the resolution made little or no discernible difference. Putting a cut at the peaks and time delayed cut on reflected frequencies (full bandwidth to 5kHz) caused a hugely unacceptably level of ‘congestion’ across the entire frequency range. Removing the time delayed cut improved the apparent clarity a bit, but not enough. Restricting the cuts to frequencies below 500Hz and the below 200Hz improved matters considerably but there was sill an unacceptably level of ‘congestion’ and it was still across the entire frequency range.
Abandoned.
3 Using a DSP to apply the cuts only to the sub (and not to the main speakers) reduced the boom from the room modes but left the musical integrity intact.
Still in use.
There is a penalty in terms preserving delicate information that has to be paid if you are going to use a DSP to process the signal sent to the main speakers.
I had a quick shufti on the jRiver site to see what is involved, and after about 8 pages of instructions my eyes glazed over.
Is this a system where you can place a microphone in the listening position and it plays various sounds to work out what needs to be done upstream of the pre-amp? or is it complicated?
For the avoidance of doubt, I don’t doubt, and haven’t suggested, that the Linn system can’t sound good, only that it can’t fix certain problems, they only being addressable in the room (and where they are significant sound quality will always be compromised if they are not addressed).
Indeed:
That accords with what I said - except for the tuneden which is a process I don’t get, instead prefering REW
Though not early reflections, and while decaying notes faster in order to compensate for long room decay sounds interesting, it would presumably make no difference to a short note with instantaneous stop, that then decays for too long in the room.
REW can do that.
DSP room correction can output an inverse signal to deal with that - but it’ll only work for one (very precise) point in the room at any one time (and sounds awful if you move more than a few 10’s of cm).
Solo use only!
Oh - can it? I didn’t know that - I thought that it just made graphs of room/speaker responses.
To me it sounds as if SO hadn‘t been setup properly. SO is not a tone control. It tackles individual misbehaving frequencies in your room and reduces their amplitude with a narrow filter. With SOv1 one should not simply switch it on and leave it at that. The calculated damping values are usually much too high and you get that soullessness. You have to go through every mode and adjust the damping of the mode individually, using your preferred listening method. Since your ears are the ultimate criterion, you are likely to arrive at a satisfactory result. Linn has a detailed procedure described somewhere on their web site.
When adjusting a mode, typically there is a narrow (few dB) margin from thin and soulless to thick and impenetrable. You have to find a suitable damping level between these two points. For me, in my room, getting a satisfactory result takes about 3-4 hours for my 6 or 7 room modes.
SOv2 is a bit quicker to implement, because there aren‘t that many variables.
In any case, SO is a great addition to an audiophile’s toolkit, and a life saver in my square room. Room modes have plagued me until Linn finally had SO in their streamers. SO is one of the reasons I won‘t be able to return to a Naim source in the foreseeable future. The other one is Naim‘s listlessness regarding active operation.
And I couldn‘t see a reason why Naim shouldn‘t add such a feature to their products. Not everyone is blessed with the means to build their ideal listening room. And why should I put up with a horrendous bass mode, when an excellent solution is available?
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I own a Linn Klimax DSM/3, and it’s been set up a one of the best Linn dealers in the Bay Area, I prefer it with the SO v2 enabled by a big margin.
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We are not all blessed with the perfect room for our listening, afford someone to set it up for me nor the ability or will to plaster acoustic treatments around a living space. My home is just that a home not a recording studio and the last thing I or my other half want is stuff to remove that feeling, putting art on acoustic panels does not do it for me. I have very limited placement options and took a long time to get the best overall position in my room for my system. Roons DSP with some help from HAF has made it all reach its full potential and sounds superb to my humble ears, I hear more in the music, better separation, timing , everything really. To me its the single biggest improvement to my system. When I am next in the market for a new amp I will be looking at one with DSP built in. I will also likely be buying in the interim a mini DSP unit for the analogue side.
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trinnov does it i think .
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Yes, the Trinnov is an interesting sounding piece of kit. Of course the same limitations as to things it simply cannot correct. In the link you posted a couple of weeks ago they were used to reduce two problem peaks arising from enforced poor speaker placement - which apparently they achieved very well, where a pair of active bass traps hadn’t been sufficient, and the 4 estimated to be needed wouldn’t fit the room - and would have cost much the same as the Trinnov.
thanks to remember my post, i have even forgotten that the PMC Fenestria set up used trinnov space optimization.
I have never tried it personally so don’t have really an idea if it will work positively or not for me ( with same natural , unforced and lively sound). I discovered that Trinnov is french also.
No need for all these stuffs, a couple of unemployed mathematicians from OxBridge would fix the room correction software for Naim in no time.
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