That’s why I thought that I would try some standard cables, as both Linn and Naim appear to recommend them.
No harm in trying.
DG…
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Catsnake 6a floating x3 here. Nothing I’ve tried as far as Sarum betters it.
G
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A very sensible position. Their kit, as do Linn’s and many others work perfectly fine with a normal domestic network setup, just as they should do.
There are possible gains to be had by experimenting here though as other threads on this subject show.
Personally, having a Linn NG KDSM, I’ve been able to try optical Ethernet via an SFP module vs copper - they do sound ‘different’ and I can understand why system and music preferences come into play here, but for me, copper still wins out, albeit with a PhoenixNET as the final switch in the chain. I avoid shielded Ethernet cables which have the shield connected at both ends to avoid any unintended ground loops.
Optical still has a place in my setup, but that’s one for another thread…
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The other thing is that as a general rule manufacturers as corporate entities tend to be agnostic when it comes to other manufacturers products. At least publicly. In private, and on an individual level as @Geko indicates, it may be a different matter.
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I find scenarios like this truly fascinating. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not doubting your judgement or experience for a second, but what fascinates me is that these sorts of things never seem to be applicable in the wider sense. They seem, for some reason, to be confined to specific situations/systems/environments.
You know the sort of thing - I heard an entry level CD player fronting £30K’s worth of amp and speakers and it was the best system I’ve ever heard. Trouble is when you try that CD player with your own system it sounds very ordinary indeed.
If we could only determine the factors involved - the magic - then we could all put together wonderful systems at a fraction of the price we pay now!
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I’m sure you are right.
G
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Network Switch Testing Time;
The set up was the same as before up to the second network switch (EE8).
Because of the testing I was planning to do, had a shorter test playlist this time, consisting of;
- Take Five; Dave Brubeck
- Paranomia; The Art of Noise (just for a difference)
- Pull Your Pants Up; Delvon Lamarr Organ Trio
- Ca’ Purange (Jungle Soul); Gene Ammons
- Woman In Blue; Wynton Marsalis
I’ve used the EE8 switch, albeit with different power supplied, from the outset from when I first got the Klimax DS/3 Dynamik, so no previous switch to compare with. So this is the first time a different switch has been used for comparison.
The new switch in question is the Netgear GS105 and the new power supply is the iFI iPower2 SMPS.
The test parameters were as follow;
1st; EE8 —> CatSnake —> EE1 —> Selekt
- Existing set up to set the baseline
2nd; EE8 —> CatSnake —> Selekt
- No difference from No. 1
3rd; CatSnake —> Selekt
- Sounded duller, the dynamics and the sparkle had gone
4th; EE1 —> CatSnake —> Selekt
- No difference from No. 3
5th; GS105 (Stock SMPS) —> CatSnake —> Selekt
- This was less detailed, percussion merged into itself
6th; GS105 (Stock SMPS) —> CatSnake —> EE1 —> Selekt
- No difference from No.5
7th; GS105 (iFI SMPS) —> CatSnake —> Selekt
- Slightly more detail on percussion, perhaps not as much bass.
8th; GS105 (iFI SMPS) —> CatSnake —> EE1 —> Selekt
- No difference from No. 7
9th; Baseline; EE8 —> CatSnake —> EE1 —> Selekt
- As per No. 1
Conclusion;
I’ve given just a basic description of what I heard, based on my system and ears and the following points were noteworthy;
- When used in any permutation, the EE1 appeared to make no difference
- The GS105 appeared to give a bit more detail in percussion, whereas, the EE8 may have a bit more bass (this may be that the GS105 just presents as a bit brighter)
- There certainly wasn’t any “wow” factor, when I reconnected everything back to the baseline
- Interestingly, when connecting straight from the Mesh Node to the Selekt, the sound did deteriorate and become duller, which demonstrates the benefit of installing a switch just before the hub
- Also shows that power supplies can also have an affect on the sound. (Couldn’t try the Chord stock SMPS on the GS105 as it is a different voltage, but I know previously, the stock SMPS sounded better on the EE8 than the iFI SMPS)
This leads me onto the question, is a boutique audiophile switch necessary for my system? Given that the EE8 is 25 times more expensive than the GS105, is it 25 times better, no not to me, it’s just different. I found this also when changing the cables, different products just sound different.
As the final caveat, this is just my opinion and very subjective. As we have seen on other threads, switches , cables, etc. all behave differently.
DG…
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How does wifi behave with selekt in contrast to the described LAN setups?
I am transferring from the FRITZ! Box via wifi to an AVM repeater and then go via cable into the selekt. Does it make sense from your point of view to add a switch like EE8 between here?
Cledi
I prefer to hardwire where I can.
I’m others can give a more technical response.
DG…
Manufacturers like linn, naim, dCS, all say the same about ethernet cables, probably because they dont make any for you to buy.
They can only recommend a cable that’s been tested and certified to a certain level that they know will work fine.
So all they can say is use a bog standard cable.
Once you start delving into ethernet cables you will quickly find that these cables are certainly not all the same.
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I used mine over Wi-Fi when I had it. I can’t say I would have been able to tell any difference between using it with Wi-Fi vs Wired over Ethernet. I used it with both wired and wireless over time in different configurations and settings.
If your Wi-Fi network is setup correctly and the environment isn’t excessively RF noisy or challenging from a building materials perspective, there’s no reason it can’t perform perfectly fine and for it to do so unhindered, as a device, its demands on the network are light even at the upper edge of its needs (24/192).
You can turn Wi-Fi and Bluetooth off but I seem to recall that the Selekt still broadcasts it’s own open SSID regardless of if you set the Wi-Fi On or Off, such that it can still be accessed for setup purposes.
The only limit to how extensively you wish to explore the options and make comparisons is your own time and finances of course, I certainly didn’t find using the Selekt over Wi-Fi was in any way a negative at least, in my experience. I still connect both my Atom and NSC222 over Wi-Fi and also have no issues there either!
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No, never have used it.
DG…
Cool, I’ve just discovered an issue in Roon where it stutters badly if I play Qobuz 192/24 for a prolonged period of time, whereas the stock Linn app sails smoothly with better SQ. The Qobuz playlist in question is the 129 khz / 24 bit Classical.
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Apologies if this has been covered before. I have only just found this topic. I’ll get through the 300 + replies when I can.
Has anyone compared the Selekt DSM Edition Hub & Organik DAC version with a Chord DAVE via DAC mode only ?
Price wise they are very similar, in country anyway.
I’m currently going DAVE>NAIM NAC 322/NPX300 PS > ATC Active 100’s.
I have my system optimized for USB & I’m not looking to ditch my 332/300 preamp combo as I simply love it.
Have a ZENITH mk3 > Phoenix USB. Not sure what input the Selekt is best, I’m assuming Ethernet ? If it’s fine with the USB/B input as well, then it has my
attention.
Even more so if it’s an improvement on the DAVE. I’ll need a demo, but I’m not 100% sure that any dealer near me had the exact combo that I’m after, Edition Hub, Organic DAC and the XLR output option.
TBH I’ve not had any demos of LINN products before, so I’m unfamiliar what the sound signature of the Selekt DSM is.
I like a fast, dynamic and detailed sound, that’s why the DAVE has been my DAC of choice and I much prefer it over other DAC’s that I have demoed it against. Like dCS Bartok, Esoteric N05XD and some others.
Any advice appreciated.
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If you want to keep your Dave, I see no other possibility than upgrading your streaming side, if you want still a better sound.
So Innuos Statement comes in mind.
You could also try to listen to DCS Rossini Apex or Naim Nd555.
Otherwise dacs like MSB, Esoteric, Linn, Totaldac, Nagra…are less on the fast side.
Maybe Weiss……
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I would have thought it would be sensible to keep the DAVE as you seem to prefer it to others you’ve tried and as you require a USB DAC into the Naim NAC/NPX setup, the Linn Selekt doesn’t really fit here.
As @frenchrooster suggests, perhaps the Innuos Statement would be worth looking at as an upgrade on the USB source ?
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Yes, it appears that I’ve had a thought bubble without really thinking it through.
I do love my DAVE, and like a fair few of us, keep thinking “ what if” a fair bit.
I was just curious about the Linn Organik DAC technology and if it is better and suits me more than the DAVE.
I think I’ll move to my power cables next or perhaps better XLR’s to my subs and ATC Active Towers.
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I don’t know where you’re based, but pop along with your DAVE to your local dealer and do a comparison to see what you think.
DG…
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Final change (I promise);
Following the changes I have made to the Ethernet Cables, HDMI Cables and Network Switches, the only thing that hasn’t been changed is the mains cable.
Presently, this is a Chord SignatureX ARAY Power Cable. I’ve made my own mains cables previously using MSHD plugs and good quality cable, so I thought that I’d make another up to try.
I like MSHD products, as do Chord, who use it on their top end mains cable. I got a Silver Plated MS328S UK plug and a Silver Plated MS9315S IEC plug, along with some Supra Cables LoRad 2.5 Mk2 SPC Shielded Mains Cable. This is to match up with the MSHD MS9297S Silver Plated Single Gang Sockets that I already have.
Made the cable up, which is very easy to do with the MSHD plugs, as they are designed for large cable with an OD of 16mm, so plenty of space for the wiring. PAT Tested the cable and all was fine.
One thing I forgot to do though, was to order a Silver Plated 5 Amp fuse as it comes with a Silver Plated 13Amp fuse. However, I tried it with the supplied fuse and it sounded good, but then changed it over to 5 Amp Bussmann fuse with polished end caps to comply with the Regs. Immediately, the sound became a bit more brasher, so I’ve ordered some Silver Plated 5 Amp fuses.
Whilst waiting for the fuses, I’ll let it settle and burn in, then do some comparison tests.
The Silver Plated 5 Amp fuses have arrived and changed the fuse over in the plug. Again, there was an immediate change, with the music becoming a bit more smoother. So I let things all settle and burn in again.
I used the same Test Playlist as used for the Network Switch, consisting of;
- Take Five; Dave Brubeck
- Paranomia; The Art of Noise (just for a difference)
- Pull Your Pants Up; Delvon Lamarr Organ Trio
- Ca’ Purange (Jungle Soul); Gene Ammons
- Woman In Blue; Wynton Marsalis
The test parameter this time was much simpler and quicker;
1st; Chord SignatureX ARAY Power Cable;
- Baseline.
2nd; MSHD / Supra LoRad Power Cable with Bussmann 5 Amp fuse with polished ends - The music appeared brasher
3rd; MSHD / Supra LoRad Power Cable with Silver Plated 5 Amp Bussmann fuse - This was more lively with a wider presentation. The detail is still there with a deep controlled bass
4th; Chord SignatureX ARAY Power Cable; - Baseline. The Chord cable is a bit smoother, perhaps not as quite as exciting.
Conclusion;
Similar to the Network Switch, the Chord SignatureX ARAY Power Cable is an expensive cable that costs over 10 times as much as the cable I made up and, is it 10 times better, no. Again, there was no “Wow” factor when I changed back to the Chord cable. Just presents different, no better, no worse. Indeed the Chord cable seemed to be duller and not as exciting.
As a side note, I’ve always been a bit sceptical of fuses and the difference that they make, but I must admit to now have that thought challenged by hearing a difference between a Silver Plated fuse and a standard fuse.
Our main music genre is Jazz and I have found that the recent changes appear to work well with it. Definitely a bit more detail with a brighter presentation. One format of Jazz that I particularly enjoy is the Piano / Bass / Drums trio, such as Bill Evans, one of my favourites. Since all the changes, I’m finding the detail of his piano playing to be delightful. Particularly so on the slower tracks, you’re waiting and anticipating the next note. The bass is nicely controlled, but deep where required.
As the final caveat, this is just my opinion and very subjective. As we have seen on other threads, switches , cables, etc. all the products behave differently.
DG…
P.S.
I’ve been told by Mrs DG to stop tinkering with the Hi-Fi as she cannot tell any difference and I’ve been told that we need a new patio.
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