Music Streaming - it's hard to find the right time

Hi Richieroo,
We auditioned the ND555 with 1 555PS on three occasions and found it to be a super way to stream music. However, we preferred the Chord pairing as explained above.

For the cost of an ND555 with 2 power supplies, we would have gone for the MSB Premier with the Powerbase (i.e. upgraded power supply) in a heart beat. To our ears, the ND555 is a brilliant streamer which brings out the very best that its dac design can manage. More modern dacs seem to have more resolution, something that a second power supply cannot address. For this reason, we saw little point in trying another power supply on the ND555. So we chose another path, while respecting others’ decisions to go for an ND555. After all, it is one of few streamers that sounds genuinely musical.

Hope this helps to clarify our logic.

Best regards, BF

4 Likes

Cheers thanks for the reply … I get your point about the cost.

One that does the job superbly and doesn’t need worrying about!

1 Like

Weelll, I was a tad tipsy, IIRC, when I wrote that post - as can be surmised from the somewhat swashbuckling style.
There again, the only Naim external PSU I’ve ever owned (555DR) “does the job superbly and doesn’t need worrying about”.
Superb here meaning literally super, Latin for ‘over and above’ what most ‘normal’ power supplies achieve.
The low noise floor, the power of the delivery, while working brilliantly the low volumes I usually listen at, separation of instruments, etc.
All that is Super.

I cannot imagine getting anything like that with a Chord DAC and PSU.
I have heard a TT in my system and various Chords extensively in a friend’s systems.
And a Dave compared with and without MScaler at a show.
And Chord is fine, but I was interested to see how the OP was dealing with the absence of his beloved 555DR.

You don’t need to imagine, as you get it (low noise floor, the power of the delivery, working brilliantly at low volumes or high, separation of instruments, etc etc etc - all that is Super) with the Chord Dave complete with its inbuilt power supply and no need of an external one! :grinning: …apparently even more so with the MScaler (and its inbuilt power supply).

Now why would they go and do a silly thing like that!
You wouldn’t want to encase an electrically noisy thang like a PSU inside the same box as a noise-sensitive DAC, would you.

[Sorry, just checked your profile and noticed that you own a Dave. Obviously, you have reconciled yourself to that design feature…]

Whilst there is less challenge having a separate power supply, Chord (and probably others) manage to overcome the issues with it enclosed in the same box. No doubt it is very much easier when you don’t have to amplify tiny analogue signals (as in a preamp), whether Dave would be even better if it used a separate power supply is of course an unknown factor… Hugo of course had a different approach, battery power with an external power supply - but then it is a tiny box. IIRC people have tried Hugo running just on batteries and PS disconnected, and running with PS connected and on, finding no audible difference.

Sounds to me as Chord give your the best its capable of out of the box. Naims is one of upselling for you to get there. I think I prefer Chords approach.

1 Like

Or……Naim provide cost-effective ways for the user to upgrade their products, negating the need to go all-in at once. That is, ‘growing’ a system in line with the users SQ needs and within the limitations of the individual user’s affordability.

Separate power supplies for their separates ranges (the higher end stuff) has always been part on the Naim DNA. Separating the noisy components from the delicate electronics seems a perfectly sensible approach. You can of course integrate less noisy SMPS, but these have their own issues as some are NOT ‘less noisy’. Linn have been successful with this approach but I much prefer the Naim sonic signature.

As with all approaches, success depends on the skill of implementing different architectures. I happen to think Naim have been very successful with their implementations across their different ranges.

Other brands of good HiFi gear are of course available.

3 Likes

Indeed - though unfortunately it means that when people go straight for the external PS option there is wasteful redundancy if the original box includes a PS

2 Likes

Jim, here i disagree with you. Some manufacturers achieved very good results with high grade SMPS, like Chord, Linn, Dcs. The last, DCS, in the top of its line , the 4 boxes upsampler, dac, clock. and transport, doesn’t use external power supply. It costs more than 100k.

2 Likes

I beg to disagree. I think that the ways Naim provides to upgrade their products are far from being cost-effective: they tend to foster redundancies of components, waste of space, energy and, finally, money.

1 Like

I do accept that progressing up the Naim ladder can cause some redundancy BUT, Naim is one of the few manufacturers where secondhand values remain strong and the dealer network have ex demo and many have pre-loved kit and will give decent trade-in prices. This is how I have, in the main, grown my system, always demoing any ex-dem/pre-loved kit at home before I commit and trading in my ‘redundant kit’.

No redundancy, lower (than new) prices, no risk and a dealer who will always sort out any issues with the kit they sell. What’s not to like. This surely constitutes ‘recycling’, and must therefore reduce energy (in the manufacture of replacement/redundant kit) and must be less damaging to the planet!

2 Likes

If you were designing a DAC with the goal not of maximising profit but of maximising only SQ, where would you locate the Power supply - in the same box or in a different :package:?

Depends if it’s a humming and vibrating PSU or not …

1 Like

Yes, I disapprove of redundancy, as a buyer and as a green.
waste = bad
That’s the very reason that I like the design of the NDS, and all other such singleminded designs.
That’s why I don’t like the idea of buying a Naim dac then using it just as a streamer and adding another Chord dac onto it.
That’s another reason why I like the fact that the 555dr adds power to the steaming section, dac and preamp of the 272 (as well as silencing the noise of the internal psu).
That’s why I am hoping, as many others are, that if and when Naim launch a 372 that it will have no internal psu and will make best use of both outputs of the 555ps as the NDS does.

2 Likes

Well, yes, they are forms of noise, and any psu will make some vibration and the vibration will create some waves in the air in the box.

But a psu will also spread electromagnetic fields around inside the box and pollute the work of the dac, and streamer if there is one.

Linn, Chord, DCS have achieved that. I prefer the Naim sound but will not say it’s better. Commercially speaking, Naim takes also advantage of all these ps upgrades.

1 Like

Hi FR
Why do you not answer my question?
Cheers
Jim

Whether that is true, or whether it is a problem, of course depends on the design, of the PS, the DAC, the renderer if there is one, and the physical case construction - an adverse effect is not evident with some products,