Like factual basis?
I’ve only had a Naim device for about 3 years, nobody informed me about the poison aspect of these things.
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Whilst we laugh and joke about the comedy text descriptions of these things, I do think the law needs to be enforced more or changed with respect to what is nothing short of IP theft and fraud.
This is a real nightmare for manufacturers who can ill afford it in these times.
Regretably the Chinese seem to think its perfectly acceptable to offer knock off products that look very similar to the ‘real thing’ which, in reality can often be dangerous due to lack of certification, compliance or proper testing.
I also think it should be illegal for Fleabay and the likes to offer counterfiet goods and should be flogged at the mast for such crimes furthermore, anyone conned by counterfeit should compensated accordingly.
Regrettably its one of those things that has been tolerated for far too long.
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not for nothing is the logo green.
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Yes, and adictive too
Don’t forget Amazon too - there are a LOT of counterfeit products making Bezos rich through secondary sellers. Apparently perfumes among the biggest offenders, but plenty of others.
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There was recently a listing on audiogon for an Olive 102. Seller listed it as a 202, claming it was upgraded to a 202 by AV Options. I never heard of that! I suspect it was just serviced and recapped. The photos were clearly of a 102.
These have been around for a long time now. I seriously doubt it’s worth even an hour’s worth of time from Naim’s lawyer. If they were being sold as an actual counterfeit (i.e. as an actual Naim OEM product) that would be a big difference, but most are ‘inspired by’ or ‘based on’ and very few would or could be mistaken for an actual Naim product (none use DIN for one thing).
Not trying to defend the practice, but I seriously doubt anyone at Naim is staying awake at night over this - nor D’Agostino, Krell, Levinson etc etc that are also being imitated, and some of those others much more counterfeit looking than the any of the Naim inspired gear. Older Naim amps and preamps don’t exactly have any secrets (other than quality manufacturing) and plenty of DIY hackerNAPS etc out there. Plus the resale value of most of this stuff is pretty much nil compared to the real deal.
True - the boards and kits have been around for ages. However, both of the items mentioned above are clearly Naim branded and made to look like the original. The enclosure/chassis is even listed as a Naim item, albeit without a capital n. TBF, though somewhat lost in translation, the listing for the completed amp suggests it is not the original, rather, it is better than the original…
With many of these products there may well be serious safety concerns and certification/compliance issues. Also, at the moment these are clearly cheap imitations, but it might not be too long before the replica makers up their game in terms of product quality. Imagine the impact on the value of classic Naim kit if identical product came from China at a fraction of the price.
If it becomes widespread it can impact on the perception of a brand. Take Rolex for example, fakes are so prevalent that if I see a Rolex, other than in an official dealer’s window, my assumption is that the product is fake.
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If you report it to Naim then they will request it removed from the site.
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Agreed, I was generalising in referring to Ebay, but the same applies to market traders, Alibaba and any organisation offering counterfiet goods as genuine.
I understand Amazon will refund if a fake product is sold but I suspect the procedure is uneccessarily complicated and may not apply to separate traders using their marketplace - If the price is too good to be true, it’s probably fake.
Dunno if it’s a genuine Naim dealer or not, but there’s a hi-fi seller in Hanoi who’s selling a 552, and, blow me, in their advert there’s a photo of an identical system to my old one! Fancy someone in Vietnam having an identical room to mine!
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What is this ‘well known auction site’? Is it eBay? It probably is eBay. My presumption is that it is eBay.
The word eBay is allowed to be used in general discussion. It’s not a euphemism for something unpleasant, it’s the world’s biggest internet auction site, it’s called eBay. Much like Amazon is probably the world’s biggest online retail outlet, yet people on here use that faux tweeness and insist on calling it ‘the river’. It’s called Amazon. Can we at least be grown-up enough on here to refer to these things by name.
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On the subject of cheap knock-offs, Gibson Guitars have been trying for years, without success, to stop the worldwide flood of cheap imported Les Paul copies.
All that’s changed is that a search on the website for “Gibson Les Paul” will usually show no results, whilst a search for “Les Paul” will reveal endless pages of so called “Chibsons”
Although they will no longer put the Gibson name on the headstock, you are re-directed to a page selling name transfers, so you can do it at home.
Now that’s really taking the Michael.
To further compound the problem, unscrupulous sellers are passing off these fakes as the genuine article on certain auction sites.
Hi all!
We run a regular trawl of eBay for fakes, and are part of eBay’s ‘VERO’ programme - if we can prove someone is infringing our rights, they will take the listings down. (And then they pop up again shortly afterwards!)
Do feel free to copy me in here if you spot any, in case we’ve missed them. As Richard says, it’s rather ‘whack-a-mole’, but everyday a listing is down and unable to mislead potential customers is a good one…
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Hi Clare,
I feel that much of the problem lies in the fact that the faking of branded goods continues unabated in China, see my post above on Gibson Les Paul guitars, and, sadly, Gibson have had little success in stemming the supply of these fakes at source.
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It’s certainly an issue. Being a more specialist brand, we are less targeted than some, thankfully, and we do what we can to protect our IP at every turn.
The bigger message to get out is that it’s always best to buy from one of our global network of specialist dealers - you can be confident you’ll get geniune product, plus all the service and support you need.
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Indeed China has a long history of copying things: sometimes very well, sometimes not, sometimes passed off as the original (i.e. counterfeits), sometimes acknowledging they are copies, however brazenly.
Interestingly with some electronic stuff their goods really can be as good as the original - and indeed they also produce original products of their own, some of which can be exceedingly good (though they are not renowned for excellence in quality control of anything mass produced).
Counterfeit goods are the main real problem, whether it be electronics, watches, clothing or illegal copies of software - and China indeed appears to be the main source at present, at least for tech stuff, though maybe not surprising given how big the country is, having getting on for 1/5th of the world population (9 times that of entire EU, 12 times that of USA). I doubt the counterfeiting will ever cease…
It certainly looks that way, and Gibson’s limited success with lawsuits has meant nothing, if no-one is going to enforce them.
Agreed, its a bit juvenile TSTL