I’m surprised by this, @ryder. When I owned the XS2 long ago, I remember really, really enjoying that Integrated with a HiCap-DR. I found it truly engaging and exciting on nearly every type of music. Personally, I feel the SN drastically outclasses it, but it’s supposed to. Then again, I wasn’t into streaming then, so my comparison and opinion are mostly moot in this region.
I’m not sure either, it may partly depend on which topology a Naim integrated amp is based, they do seem to have some different characteristics between lines. The Nait 5si for instance has a much lower noise floor of 75dB compared to the SN3’s 63dB.
I understand yes. In the case of the NDX2, this is the second most expensive digital source Naim offers, priced a bit above the 250DR without a separate PSU. So perhaps it’s not surprising that it technically would outclass an integrated amplifier like the Supernait 2/3, which are priced lower than the 250DR but have a lot more features they need to provide, including the preamp section etc.
So pricewise i think the NDX2 can be considered to be in a different (higher) range than the Supernaits…
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Perhaps it was a mismatch between the amp and speaker. I used the Nait XS on Harbeth SHL5 and it sounded almost the same as the Rega Elicit mk2. I was looking at a Naim amp to replace the Rega Elicit in my system and had both amps to compare at one time. I bought the 202/200 instead and this one sounded a lot better than the Nait XS, with the Harbeth.
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That’s a great explanation. I owned the Elicit MK2 as well, but not for long. It was in a secondary system with, strangely enough, Harbeth P3-ESRs. I know exactly what you’re saying…
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Supernait 3 and NDX 2 is a beautiful combination - absolute two-box sweet spot right there.
Forget the tech specs for once and just listen to this combo in action: it’s magical!
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Well precisely, it’s not like you’re going to be sat on the sofa with a multimeter in your hands labouring over measurements.
I’ve got exactly that combo + Powerline + Hi-Line + NAC A5 with a pair of Kanta 1’s either side of it.
They both sit within the Classic range and having owned and used an ND5 XS, ND5 XS2 and most recently NDX 2 can only sing the praises of the NDX 2 and the refinement it brought to my system. I’d say the same having moved from a SN2 to a SN3 which itself brought a little extra sprinkling of Naim magic.
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I’m only pointing out that any details rendered above vinyl quality would objectively be lost in the background noise on the SN3.
That doesn’t mean that people can’t enjoy or prefer an NDX2 with an SN3, but for new buyers it’s something to be aware of, considering the high price of the NDX2.
Everyone is ofcourse encouraged to try out for themselves what they prefer and if it’s worth the money to them.
VTA 
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And spacer
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Sorry, but you’re being way too binary here. You cannot judge the performance of a product based on one technical figure! There are so many elements that contribute to a product’s performance, not just a single measurement.
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Performance is a subjective term, i wasn’t talking about anything subjective. I was only referring to the noisefloor of the SN3, which is a single unambiguous figure. The noisefloor of the SN3 is about the same as the SNR of vinyl, so anything exceeding that cannot be audibly rendered. There’s really not much to argue about here i think.
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We’ve had endless discussions about blind testing in relation to network equipment. Please, please, please, don’t start bringing arguments about signal to noise ratios into streamer and amplifier matching. It’s not helpful and will be really annoying if it continues.
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No there is not.
Demo a ND5 XS 2 vs a NDX 2 with a SN 3 then post your findings. It certainly would have more substance then making judgmental statements about a system based upon your reading of a technical paper. So it may have value to you, but unless you have actually listened it really does not carry weight.
JMHO - YMMV
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HH, why would it be annoying if i point out that certain things objectively cannot be audibly rendered on an SN3, but wouldn’t it be annoying if you keep telling people that their sources are too low quality for their speakers?
There’s some serious double standards persisting on these forums.
I’ll end with a quote from Stereophile founder Gordon Holt:
“Audio as a hobby is dying, largely by its own hand. As far as the real world is concerned, high-end audio lost its credibility during the 1980s, when it flatly refused to submit to the kind of basic honesty controls (double-blind testing, for example) that had legitimized every other serious scientific endeavor since Pascal. [This refusal] is a source of endless derisive amusement among rational people and of perpetual embarrassment for me…”
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For once I have to disagree. The mentioned S/N ratio is nothing to write home about, but we are all living with the Naim hiss, and most of us happily. This does not mean that the SN3 can’t resolve finer details and that an NDX2 is wasted on it. The 252 (in particular) hisses much more than cheaper pres from other manufacturers, but the 252/300 nevertheless sounds better than quieter amps (that I’ve heard)
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For what it’s worth, this is a case of myself completely understanding both sides of the last few posts; however, I do think @litemotiv has a valid point if only arguing within the context of what he said. I don’t think anyone here would disagree that there is more to a component’s ‘sound’ or performance than a signal-to-noise ratio or other singular measurement. He isn’t wrong here. It’s just one aspect of the sound to consider here, and I think that’s all he’s pointing out…and that’s all I took from it.
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Well I can see that my question has now turned into a debate about NDX2 /ND5 but as I have previously asked, I just wanted an opinion on Xs2 to SN3.
To date, I have run Superuniti, Musical Fidelity m6500i, Uniti Star with NAP250 with this setup and now xs2.
The xs2 with my Marantz is the best it has sounded, I was just interested in upgrading to SN3.
Although I’m sure a NDX2 would be best, It’s not practical atm, I also don’t believe you can dismiss a component based solely on price if you never tested it.
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I apologize, personally, for the thread drift. Sometimes it tends to do this, but honestly in a positive way. I learn a lot from some of the drifts.
But I digress…I do think the SN3 is worth the upgrade if for no other reason than it would be a solid one, in theory. I still contend that your XS2 is a great Integrated, and upgrading the streamer (not with an NDX2, necessarily) with your existing amplifier to an ND5 XS2 will reap highly positive benefits.
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I’ve had a ND5 XS 2 into a SN3 and then upgraded to a NDX 2. As good as the entry player is (for it’s price), it’s not as good as a NDX 2, in any shape or form. Add a XPS DR and it totally leaves the baby player for dust.
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I had the Sonos connect to my SN2. It was actually pretty good. Not great but good enough for Spotify back in the olden days.