Yes, a 222 would seem to be an expensive solution. It would be a nice step up from the nova and I would only consider buying used. It could be an end game system for me if it has the desired effect of changing the presentation of the 250DR to the way i prefer.
I sometimes wonder if perhaps the 250DR was replaced by a used NC 250 (and stick with the nova), that might be an equally effective upgrade, and would for sure take away the 250DR sound presentation from the equation. But I have never heard a NC 250, it could be even worse for me (my room, speakers, etc)… But I do keep hearing that its a solid step up from the 250DR, so the ‘performance’ of it is not in doubt.
Last March I upgraded my Star to a 222/NPX300 and was blown away by the uplift in SQ, The 222 would be an improvement over the Nova but whether it gives the sound you want is another matter. As others have suggested, go to a dealer and do a comparison between the two setups. I know someone who had the Nova with a 250DR and they never complained the system sounded bright, they traded in the Nova for an Atom HE because they regularly use headphones and think the HE sounds a little better with the 250DR than the Nova did.
Look at it logically. You previously had the same speakers, the Nova, and no problems. But added the 250dr and broke the spell.
The amp is the variable that changed. And speakers set the tone (no pun intended) for the whole system. But you’re pondering whether changing the one box that hadn’t changed is the solution as opposed to the variable that caused the issue or the speakers? I think you might have that the wrong way around.
Unless you subconsciously just want a 222 and want to justify the purchase.
Havong added a 250dr once to replace a non dr 250, I know that while it is a better amp, it is a different amp. I had to change speakers as the dr just didn’t cooperate with my speakers as well as the older 250 did. Changing the source and preamp to solve the issue would never have occurred to me. But that is what you’re contemplating.
I’d suggest a second hand but serviced old 250 is the least expensive option to try. Followed by speakers. But if you want a 222, just admit it to yourself and buy one. But beware, it won’t be the end of your journey to solve this issue.
You put me words of my mouth. I wouldn’t however be able to formulate it better.
+1 for 222 or Atom HE, but a listening is mandatory before buying.
In general, with Naim, it’s not optimal to have a lesser pre vs the amp .
Point well made. Interestingly, with NC series, some reports here of NSC222 + 350 amps. However balance or towards source first is a good guiding principle. It’s not an absolute!
As @feeling_zen highlights, the balance is unsettled adding NAP to Nova.
This is a combo that has been the subject of posts previously. Some have found it works, likely depending on personal preference, room and speakers. Don’t recall anyone reporting on blind listening.
Nova in my case, didn’t control the speakers well enough - very much open minded, added NAP250DR - soon rejected for the reasons others have mentioned.
Nova has given way to NSC222 + NC250. This is a genuine match. The 250DR does fall some way short, so to get the true benefit of 222 imho, the NC250 is the NAP to add. No special cable needed. Pricey perhaps, so alternatives from OC kit are an option. If budget constrains choice, then 272 + existing NAP250DR would be an option, using workarounds if Qobuz is a stream of choice.
I hear what you are saying. I suppose I am thinking along the lines of source first. You could say that the nova streamer and pre is outclassed by the 250DR, so my rationale is that a better pre and streamer (222) may tip the balance of the system to a slightly more refined presentation.
Yes I do like the idea of getting a 222 but I don’t want to invest any further than that - a nc 250 is not an option nor is changing my speakers.
They’re not the same. A 222/250DR is going to sound a lot better than any of these options. Ideally you’d get a 250NC b/c it’s a much better amp than the DR.
The DAC chip isn’t necessarily the whole story though, I dug out the basis/rationale for my probably a bit over the top/bold statements, and replied to the post you quote above
On the plus side the NSC222 has a better volume control implementation, and can be improved by an external PSU. On the minus side (as with any integrated solution) there’s a lot of electronics crammed into a single box.
My point was that the NSC222 seems to be a pretty good Naim streamer, a pretty good Naim headphone amp and a pretty good Naim pre-amp. In a single box. That, in the context of a Naim system at least, represents fair VFM in my opinion
And I should say, I haven’t heard one! I’m just mildly curious if it is worth considering one, rather than a ND5 XS2. I was surprised to read about the similarities between it and the Atom HE, and that fact changed my opinion about its perceived value for the better.
Might your use case be a genuine reason to audition the Nova power edition? You seemed to really like the original nova’s sound, easy to listen to, and added a 250DR, I assume for more oomph!? The PE probably retains more of the sound signature than most options discussed so far?
I also wonder if a nc 250 was added to a standard nova whether the presentation would be move nova-like. After all, the nova and the NC 250 are both new generation with a different sound presentation to OC.
Yes, I still have both the HE and the 222 and have compared them directly in several ways with the SN3, with non Naim power amps and with the NC250 now but not with the 250DR.
The HE is so good that for streaming and for anyone who does not need more demanding analogue throughput and vinyl, and does not plan for the NPX300, I would really recommend the HE.
The 222 has a slightly better DAC implementation possibly and a better preamp but the HE is full on a NC sound and only appreciably slightly less convincing in a direct A-B.
I’m thinking you got the 250 to upgrade so the best way forward, according to me is to go for the 222 if your intention is to get ahead of what the Nova did. Also you can then later on ad an NPX300 and go even further. I would however considering part exchange both the Nova and 250 and get NC all the way. That way you get the synergy and no probs with cables. The 250DR having the old single ended xlr complicating things.
I went for a demo today at HiFi Corner in Edinburgh. I am looking to firstly get new speakers and possibly take up the offer for the Supernait 3 and NDX 2. At the moment I have a Nait XS2 and Flatcap. Super impressed with the Supernait 3, voiced similar to the Nait XS2 but more power, but now have the quandary of the NSC 222 and NAP 250.
The first demo was the Supernait 3/ND5XS2 with Harbeth 30 XD. Then the same set up with Wharfedale Linton. Then the NSC 322/NAP 250 with Wharfedale Linton.
Had a good listen to them… beautiful sound and a pair of absolute beauties to look at.
I have some serious thinking to do now…
I picked up a (pre loved but as new) 222 this week and run it with a Nap200. Very pleased with the functionality & sounds great using a good quality 2rca - 4pin din rather than the £259 bespoke cable. I also have an Atom HE and tried it direct to the 200, I couldn’t tell much difference streaming, however the analogue input for my P8 really is streets ahead on the 222, I had another pre for the TT before as the HE didnt do it justice. Will get the NC 250 when funds allow but for now I’m still enjoying great music.
. Crikey. Presume the DAC is different?