I’ve been making my way thru all those posts. You seem to be the only one asking about the headphone output. It’s still kind of shame for that cost they didn’t include the extra connections. Hard to say if you’ll loss anything with single ended. Will gain better resolution and control but possible could come at sacrifice of larger soundstage. If you were hooking to an external headphone amp, the new 222 is the clear winner without taking cost into the equation.
And normally with cable changes, it slight changes in tone and little difference in soundstage due to extra clarity. The 4.4mm definitely has a better presentation than single ended in the way it separates the sound. At least with my Caldera.
I did see that but still need to keep in mind if your particular headphone will perform better with the balanced connection. If the 222’s improved DAC helps with better flow, resolution, more refined sound but doesn’t improve over the HE single end soundstage, not sure I’d take that improvement. I actually think the HE’s less technical performance compared to other setups doesn’t hurt it because it’s still so musically and enjoyable.
I had the Chord Dave setup with mscaler before and while it’s more technical, I didn’t enjoy it as much. Same with headphones. I think the Expanse is technically the better headphone over the Caldera but I enjoy the Caldera so much more. It’s colored, little looser, but oh so much fun.
I guess only way to find out is to hear it for yourself. I’m sure they’ll hopefully be some comparisons in the future.
Yeah agreed. My first order of business is sorting out my speakers situation so any serious thoughts of the 222 will have to wait. By then there should be enough info about real world experiences with it.
I’d also imagine at that price range, there might be better options for headphones. If I had the money, I would just add Woo WA23 headphone amp to the HE and then add the 222 later. But think I’m at my end game. Once I have my new cables and headphone stand from ZMF I’m done. Possible pad swap would be last thing. The only thing is I lost access to my listening chair.
Didn’t even realize I posted that pic in this thread already. Swapped with similar pic. But yeah, new to cats, so don’t realize they stake their claim. That chair never worked for the dog. He prefers the couch. But if he’s in my spot can just throw a toy.
Yeah they pretty much take over and move vertically in the house. And when you throw a toy for THEM they give little paw gestures telling you what to go do with yourself.
Hello ,
I own a NDX used as streaming transport, feeding the nDac which is connected to a PSU XPS-DR.
I am interested by the Atom HE ( one box , new streaming platform + preamp to connect it to my power amp)
Should I loose quality ?
Yes, it will be a big step down. Not sure what preamp you use now, and obviously this is relevant, but unless your system is very badly set up it should sound miles better than an Atom.
My new ZMF Silver 4.4mm arrived. It does improve the sound further with more clarity, shimmer and air. But as for a soundstage, is just a slight improvement over the $100 OFC 4.4mm. It’s generally the same presentation but a little more detail, depth, and better accuracy in location. But the general shape of the soundstage is very similar. But the change from stock single end to 4.4mm had a bigger effect on the presentation. Something about the single ended seemed less hifi and don’t think it was just the cable.
I also found the full post of why their balanced connection is better. So something to consider if thinking about the 222 for headphone use. It’s possible all the other improvements make this a non issue.
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A journalist asked the same question. This was Steve Sells’ excellent answer:
"The pre-amp output is pseudo balanced i.e. balanced impedance. Great for long runs (for example, to active loudspeakers) and cancels noise pick up. The headphones are actually single ended. There’s only a stereo amplifier driving them. The advantage of the 4 pin XLR and Pentaconn is not to have a balanced connection but to have a 4 wire connection. This connection allows for a separate ground for Left and Right channel. On a 3 pin headphone socket the ground connection for L&R is shared. This shared connection degrades the sound.
Having a true balanced drive would not affect the headphones themselves. Headphones are just a coil in a magnetic field. It doesn’t matter if one end of the headphone coil goes negative and the other end goes positive or if one end stays at ground and the other end moves 2x as far. There will be no pick up like long runs of interconnect cable.
Having balanced headphone amplifiers (or bridged) could in some circumstances sound worse. Not because of the headphone but because now there’ a more complex amplifier driving the headphone. A balanced amplifier will cancel its low order even harmonic distortions such as 2nd. It will then add the odd ordered harmonics such as 3rd. The cancellation of 2nd psychoacoustically exposes the increased 3rd. The 3rd may sound a bit more forward and fatiguing. Each half of a bridged headphone amp effectively sees half the impedance compared to a single ended amp for the same impedance headphone. This again increases 3rd harmonic. Best to keep the harmonics low order. 2nd harmonic is barely audible."
As context, the link I put above to the 222 thread is also Steve Sells commenting directly on the forum stating that the 222 is better as a headphones amplifier than the HE despite only using the unbalanced connection.
That’s what I thought! And Tks for your advice.
Preamp: Rotel RC1590 , Power Amp Michi S5.
I love the sound of the NDac, The NDX works perfect to read all the FLAC files from my NAS , but tis slightly obsolete to listen to Qobuz Sublime ( I use mconnect which isn’t really ‘sexy’) .
That’s why I thought to the Atom HE.
Other option is to replace the NDX by the ND5XS2 .
As I don’t use the internal DAC, the NDX2 would be under used.
I think I’m just hung up on this line from his new comment listed below. We all know that sometimes small improvements can seem bigger depending on preference and headphones. Still think would have been nice to have everything maximized.
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The separate left an right ground on the Pentaconn and 4 pin XLR technically improves channel separation. If the sockets are clean this advantage is very small.
Yeah on noticed that too. But that, as I read it, becomes a question of headphones on the 222. While it should outperform the HE regardless due to the rest of what the unit is. It was surely a compromise as it is not a dedicated headphone solution. I think if they had space for one connector and they chose XLR that would exclude a lot of headphones that folks have.
Certainly worth listening to an ND5XS2 in your system, I’m not sure it would be a sound quality upgrade over your NDX but you do get better streaming and connection options.
Another option would be NDX2 using your XPS to power it instead of the NDAC. 2 boxes instead of 2, but listen to it very carefully before deciding to part with your NDAC!
Yes, I agree that just an XLR socket would have been a bad choice. But how hard would have it been to add the 4.4mm balanced socket in an addition to the single ended. Then you have balanced and people could always get XLR to 4.4mm adapter if don’t already have the cable. Not that I have the money, but would have at least made the thought of upgrading more tempting.
For me, the Naim HE is my end game for headphone listening. I already did the over $10k route and turns out the HE was more enjoyable. Not to say going higher up in the Naim lineup wouldn’t be rewarding, just not worth the cost for me.
