Next upgrade: more from the bass!

Anyone that’s bought anything will swear by it. :wink:

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very, very good advice…

@richardjpaterson did you not say you are after tweaks - adding a sub is not a tweak surely?

I would examine what drove you to raise your ask her in the first place - what was it that you felt unhappy - or not as happy as you wanted - and focus on that. If its a subtle thing in tonal balance - then as suggested you won’t likely need to throw money at it, not to begin with at least - but subtle movement of your speakers within your room can sometimes make a noticeable difference in balance. ITs worth remembering that in the vast majority of home setup the speaker couples with the room to provide the audio response - and those movements can be quite small to make a noticeable difference. Once you find good spots - it’s worth taking a photo, and measuring - as if you decorate etc - you will likely want to return the speakers to those points.

If curiosity is driving you - ie what do power lines, power supplies and interconnects do to your system performance- then absolutely give them a try, why not? It’s a big part of the hobby - you will probably enjoy what they do - but that is going to be different from your speaker / room coupling.

And also worth remembering - the performance will only ever be compromise for the vast majority of your recordings - as they tend to be all recorded, mixed and produced differently - often to add to the artistic effect. But if you can get voices sounding natural for the vast majority of your recordings - you should be onto a winner

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I’ll second that for sure, when listening to BBC Radio 3 I often sit up and take notice as to how the presenter or news reader sounds - in my case very well fortunately but I am using a very natural sounding speaker. Another good one is Roger Waters Dark Side of the Moon Redux, it has a brilliantly recorded narration.

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And my point here is that there is the first, easiest, and certainly lowest cost place to start. I recommend using REW software to assist - you can literally see the effect of changes instantly, and with speakers in any position you can readily assess different listening positions. (it is free, but you will need a measuring microphone - the one they recommend costs around £120, or can readily be found secondhand for about 2/3rds that, and redily moved on afterwards if you don’t think you’ll ever need again) You can of course consider moving your seat or placing another one in best position when wanting sound at its best, returning to normal at other times. (In my room best sitting position is just under 3m from front wall, in a 7m room, with speaker front baffles about 0.7m from front wall.)

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Or swear at it, depending on its success!

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A poor sounding system may be the better trade-off.

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Thanks @james_n @Gruido71 @AndyJ @Skeptikal @Simon-in-Suffolk @Innocent_Bystander for comments on speaker position.

I think I’m going to be between a rock and hard place on this one. I’ve spent a lot of time in the past with speaker position. I removed some built-in furniture and brought the speakers closer together. This opens up the soundstage.

Ive had the speakers further back, and the bass is better, but the midrange gets smeared and the top end is a little bright too. I’ve just moved the speaker back again this morning and it’s the same. There is a magic spot between 45-50cm where the midrange and treble really open up, there is more air around the instruments and everything just sounds better. I’m convinced that’s the point I reduce the first reflections from the windows on each side of the room (interestingly the angle becomes around 45deg out from the tweeter).

The downside of this speaker position is the bass, but overall music puts a bigger smile on my face with how they are now. The detail and realism of the sound is wonderful.

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Yes, early reflections from nearby side walls can really muddle the sound (windows possibly worse than walls, especially as they can’t be treated other than covering with heavy curtains). Have you tried also playing with ‘toe-in’? Very likely if the speakers are in the position where side reflections are an issue, increased toe-in would reduce the reflections, though possibly at the expense of soundstage width – if so maybe worth trying the speakers further apart at the same time.

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I don’t have these myself, but quite a few folks on here have reported an improvement in bass when they put Gaia Isoacoustic feet on their speakers. By all accounts you can try before you buy

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I was just thinking this myself - I mostly swore at the Melco while I had it

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You could also try the Townshend Seismic Podiums on a free trial basis (sale or return), as these disconnect the 'speakers from the floor, which can help tidy-up the bottom-end (in particular), which then brings enhanced clarity to the upper/mids.

It’s a mad hobby this…!

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Lovely table.

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REL S/510 in the Right Hand Corner. The Rel will also expand the sound-stage!

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Newsreaders on BBC R4 have helped me place many a speaker :slight_smile:

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That is an interesting statement - as low bass energy tends to be monophonic - and in most modern productions is managed to be mono to avoid ghastly inconsistent cancellation effects - so curious how adding a mono sub will open up the sound stage. I can totally understand underpinning the sounds and giving more weight - but expanding the sound stage feels like alchemy to me

Changing to DR will accentuate the bass and mid without much effect at the top end. The sc will be a good replacement for the hc and save having to buy two hcdr. Whether that will give you as much bass as you want, ( you mention slam), though is a moot point. For slam you may need to try a sw. I can’t recommend that though as my personal choice is to not use them in a stereo set up.

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given the numbers you quoted as a way to convey what you are seeking; I’d say most certainly doable via power/cable changes.

(which is exactly what the OP is asking for)

Trying to answer the question for the OP, and not for anyone else’ (whose idea of the smallest bass incremental ‘upgrade’ requires adding a subwoofer!)- lets just say we all may have different experiences with the changes in amps and ‘front end’ that can make huge differences to bass output.

I’d just qualify ‘yes’ you can find that last nth of sound quality improvement via the list you provided.

In fact I will give an example where I had to tone DOWN the sub in a room due to a cable change.
I had been playing with digital cables into fairly mid tier/‘upper entry level’ DACs.
At the time I was using a Chord Hugo / iFi Diablo trying to figure out which one was going to be the keeper…
changing (digital) cable aided the delivery of zeros and ones SO MUCH (on this occasion/in this setup) that the super long wavelength of bass notes (eg twenty metres long ‘cycle’ for a 20hz ‘note’), was noticeably impacted.
It made sense as the higher frequency stuff isn’t so obvious in such visceral ways, but when the number of correct reads (in a row) was noticeably improved, I had to tune down the subwoofer by somewhere between 0.5dB-1.5dB (yes around about a 1dB average).

It was overwhelming to the point that the partner and kid had picked up on the change (no ask).

Arguably this is akin to improving a transport (in some regards), and so even though ‘digital’ is perceived as ‘binary’ in nature, the results of the ‘system’ can be many ‘shades of grey’…

the best analogy I can offer with regards to this is - scratched CDs become trebly in nature when playing back.
We can argue that error correction cannot reintroduce ‘what isn’t there’, but it just comes down to how LONG those bass frequencies are, and NEED so much ‘perfect’ reads to really play out well.
(error correction, I imagine, would have the EASIEST time with low frequencies, it would be phase shifts and ‘fast transients’ where the timing could be out by ‘small margins’)…

Anyhow, bass alteration of the amount sought after by the OP based on very well written explainations given in this thread: easy to achieve via ‘cables’.

Can you loan a Schiit tone control box for home demo? Many might scoff but it may help and returned at no cost if not. The equaliser on my McIntosh amp is used subtly to good benefit.

You need to be careful, the OP started off with ‘slam’ which is not subtle and is about sound pressure at very low frequencies, and then admitted to overstating and talking about subtle bass weight, therefore I suggest qualifying the likely modifications to the audio with suggestions.
I think many have said bass weight and I agree is mostly about speaker positioning and coupling in the room.
Interconnects can filter and highlight certain parts of the audio spectrum like a tone control as discussed, but that can’t change the physics of a speaker room coupling or even amp speaker coupling.
In room environments there are typically many reflections that can rob bass, cause peaks, create holes in mid frequencies, cause unstable stereo field etc…
I think most have said sort out the listening environment then tweak to subtly highlight or add warmth to taste.
The OP has now landed through the thread they are really at this point.

Personally I advise against using cables as tone controls, it’s in exact and can introduce unattractive artefacts, and create relatively poor audio.
For example adding warmth is typically subtly lifting 100 to 300 Hz by a couple of dB… that’s quite a specific ask for a cable.

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If you want bass … you need these!
Pmc bb5

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