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Sounds like an enjoyable and productive listening session.

Going from smallish monitor speakers to quality standmounts and improving amllification will all make a big difference.

So are you looking to change speakers and amplification and get LP12?

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The LP12 is a definite upgrade, that will come first. Then later this year I will look at the amplification and decide on whether to change up the Hegel for something else, I probably will.

The speakers will be last to change but only if they are necessary, I would like to see what my ATC 7’s can do attached to a better amp.

Around 15 months or so ago I was chatting with the guys in the Hifi store where I used to live about an upgrade path and they said that whilst they very much liked the Hegel they thought that I should look at something with a bit more oomph under the casing.

Nothing is going to change until later in the year, too many big bills to sort out at the moment but by April/May I should be able to start the ball rolling along the upgrade path.

Cheers

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Not sure if this is the right LP12 improvement hierarchy but here’s the one I’ve followed over many years with my current (and final) level in brackets.

1/ Bearing (Karousel)
2/ Sub chassis (Keel)
3/ Power Supply (Klimax Radikal 2)
4/ Top plate (TA Karmen)
5/ Tonearm (Ekos SE/1)
6/ Cartridge (Ekstatik)
7/ Phono stage (Rega Aura)

Is this the generally accepted priority or are there different views?

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1,3,2,5,6,7
Number 4 = is after market and not included in the official Linn order.
The standard top plate should come with everything.
Linn would only recommend one of their own phono stages.
The way it is. :+1:t2:

Official Linn Info
What is the upgrade hierarchy of Linn LP12?

The suggested order for upgrading is as follows: LP12 Transport (Sub-chassis, Baseboard etc.), Motor and Power Supply, Tonearm and Arm-cable, Cartridge, Phono Stage, Pre-amplifier, Power-amplifier, Loudspeakers.

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I think the order does vary a little bit, depending on where the deck is in the hierarchy. But I would agree with it overall except for the phono stage, I think once you get to a Selekt level deck then a good phono stage is a good investment and whilst purists could say wait until the deck is at a higher level, I chose to get the phono stage. However, I must admit I am a recent convert to this viewpoint having experienced the difference the NVC/NPX TT made to my system.

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A few thoughts.

  1. AFAIK, any ‘new’ LP12 will come with the Karousel bearing as standard. So, this is only an upgrade on older, non-Karousel decks.
  2. The Sub-Chassis and Power Supply are both valid upgrades. I would not be too fussed on the order of these two.
  3. Any Top Plate change is non-OEM. So skip that.
  4. Tonearm - yes, but again I wouldn’t worry about the order.
  5. Cartridge & Phono stage need to be regarded as a pair, as what Phono Stage you need depends on the Cartridge and visa versa.

This is supposed to be a ‘fun’ hobby - so strict hierarchy should be left it its corner. IMO. YMMV… :sunglasses:

[my own actual version was -
Arm - PS #1 - Cartridge - Sub-Chassis #1 - Bearing - PS #2 - Sub-Chassis #2]

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Ittok - Valhalla - Asak - Glued Steel S/S - (big gap) - Cirkus (and Steel Cirkus S/S) - Lingo 1 - Kore

YMMV. etc.

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I have upgraded 1, 3 (Akurate Radikal 1) and 7 so far, with 2 next on the list and then 5.

I will definitely leave the cartridge until later years as a move to an expensive MC is not a risk I’m willing to take with young children in the house!

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How long have you got, and how many opinions do you want?

Your list looks good, but opinions will differ and there is no Linn police force - it’s only meant to be for playing music after all, so whatever works for you is right.

I also suspect upgrade priorities depend on what you have before you upgrade.

For example, most here (including me) would rate a Radikal well above a Lingo 4, but if you have an old Valhalla-era sub-chassis, then I would definitely do that first - unless that cartridge is an old K9 hanging off an old Basil arm, in which case (say) both a Lingo and a Kore can be put on the ‘plenty good enough for now’ list, and more basic options may also outlast arm and cartridge.

I also rate a Karousel, but if I still had a Cirkus with a Lingo 1 or Valhalla (or a really not great arm, cartridge, phono etc), then I would do any or all of those before the bearing.

I would also say that I have and like a Stiletto, so have gone even further on top plate, base and the plinth between. However, I would put Ekos (or Aro for the hardcore enthusiast?) much higher in importance than any of those.

I’d also put a good phono stage higher on the list, even if you don’t go quite as far as an Aura - DV P75 mk 4 is amazing SQ per £ and a Superline. is imho even better.

Some will say that a Stiletto is not made by Linn and this it is no longer an LP12 and/ or should not be considered/ discussed or included on the list at all, even if it does sound slightly better (which it does). That will probably be their stance on top plates too.

A smaller number will only discuss Linn phono stages and cartridges. That seems more consistent than allowing discussion of other choices here but not on top plate, but even harder to defend on SQ per £.

One other thing you could add to the list is T-cable versus old cable.

More important than that to many of us would probably be what is under your LP12 - there is not much point having a £5k cartridge if it is on a sideboard and not much point having one at all if the needle bounces every time you walk across the room.

It is also not great if the TT power supply box is really close (physically or electronically) to the power feeding amplification, or if any of the kit is on a shaky house ring supply - does it make a noise when the fridge is opened or sound worse if you plug in a kettle?

There have been threads on almost all these topics, and for good reason. That alone probably tells you that there will not be widely agreed rankings/ answers to almost any of this.

In any case, it seems that you have a high spec LP12 and like it. Job done, surely?

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Wonderful post @NickofWimbledon and you introduce some important points.

Like the starting point for the upgrades, the aspect of good enough (for now) in light of other changes, the interaction of all the parts, and what the home situation is. And it should be a nice experience!

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There is no such thing, those are selling guidelines from Linn to their dealers. These myths don’t do anything to help end users, they are meant to line Linn’s pockets (and their loyal dealers). The next item to upgrade is the weakest link, and it is always system dependent as @NickofWimbledon eloquently explained:

:100:

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Yes it most certainly is job done for me. It sits atop a Fraim with the “Brains & Brawn” configuration and it suits me down to the ground. 42 years after buying my LP12 I’m now happy to say it will see me out now.

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Which one , the one with the Hadcock arm , the Naim ARO or the Rega arm ? :slight_smile:

Hi the post you’ve quoted me from only has an lp12 in it.
See below.

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I think I jumped from a reply to your original post . Easy done , my bad !

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I’ve never done anything like that. :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

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You would, and I argued strongly for retaining production, but at the time the numbers being sold, did not justify the factory replacing the stocks of critical parts due to the numbers, they would have had to buy in order to perpetuate production. Later, as the vinyl resurgence increased in momentum. I’m sure there were some regrets as to that decision. Thankfully I was fortunate to buy five of the last six AROs made back then, And as I recall, they sold within a couple of weeks, when people realised production had finally ceased after several rumours circulating around this forum at that time.
The ARO if correctly set up can sound amazing. Utterly sublime but equally, if poorly set up, then it could sound poor, as compared to some other arms being manufactured at that time. Set up is key with all things, ARO and LP12 miners, know that here, and that’s why they hang onto them. Yes only 1350 made in production… there were a Small number of staff builds Which I have seen crop up from time to time increasing this number slightly, but there’s no real hard information as to how many additional tops were made.
Anyway, for those who are interested, here is an LP12 ARO I set up last week :slight_smile:
KR, Peter

A little note for Graham55 :slight_smile: Hi And I had to travel a little bit further than Brighton this time!! :wink:


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Good morning, Peter, that’s a lovely plinth on that LP12, and is that a wooden-bodied Denon cartridge, or something equally rare and exotic?

I could do with your help at some point, as the bias weight thread on my ARO detached itself. I tried to source a replacement on eBay, but now have a few nylon threads and the weight. I need some helpful soul who can tie or glue one up to the requisite length - to match the weight that I have on the LP12 upstairs.

Thank you for such a comprehensive explanation. It’s a shame production stopped and it’s no longer possible to include the Aro on the list of options when selecting an arm for the LP12. At least we know why, now. Your enthusiasm for the arm is infectious even though I personally chose an Ekos when compared 30 odd years ago. I did, however, buy a Karousel bearing recently, something you advised me to do before Christmas (in an earlier reply). That was sound advice.
Regards.

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Your views on the Collaro mat on the LP12 ARO Peter ?

Or indeed mats in general vs standard Linn mat ?

Regards

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