How do owners see their 222 in terms of value/share of cost between its two key functions. Is it essentially a very good preamp that just happens to have streaming capability, or is it a 50/50 balanced preamp and streamer in terms of component cost, value, price?
Reason for asking: I had my trusty 1980s era Rega P3 connected to my 222 phono input, but the turntable itself wasn’t optimally positioned as I didn’t have an available shelf. The sound was way below the 222 so I dismissed it as inferior to the streaming side of the 222.
I have just got round to positioning the Rega in a more robust way on a sturdy cabinet, albeit on the other side of the room, connected to Rega mini fono and a 5M cable to the 222, the intention was to use occasionally to listen to my single collection. Lo and behold, the sound of the Rega is significantly improved, I guess I was taken aback at how much the support impacts performance - my first practical demonstration and I now get it.
Anyway, the big surprise, I can’t hear much difference at all now between the P3 through the 222 versus using the 222 as a streamer which given the costs of each, I’m rather taken aback.
Anyone else experienced similar. Is your turntable a better source to the streaming side of the 222 or perhaps you’ve tried another streamer through the 222 with positive results. I’m playing records again which is worrying
The phono stage in the 222 is very good, somewhere between a Rega Fono and Aria. When I used my LP12 through the 222 phono stage it was better than streamer but not by much. With a better phono stage, the TT is much better than the streamer section. I think with the NPX 300 the 222 streamer is between the NDX52 and the NDX2.
Wow! I know this hobby is extremely subjective but if this is the level the streamer is on it’s truly disappointing given the the price of the 222. The streamer should be significantly better than the Rega, as far as I am concerned. Even without an external power supply. With it, it should be closer to an NDX2.
Now, I have an NDS/555 and it betters my record deck which is a Goldnote Mediterraneo with external power supply and PH 10 RIAA and a cart that costs as much as the Rega deck. Some people has indicated the 222 would be better than the NDS. To me the subjectiveness of this sport is becoming kind of ridiculous. Not at all having a go at you Marq, but rather those hyperbole statements about the new gear that circulates.
Don’t forget that some people prefer to hear sound modified by the non-ideal transfer characteristics of a turntable in preference to the ‘technically’ superior ‘neutral’ sound of digital audio.
I would have expected so as well and it is better, it handles bass in a more controlled way and with better definition for instance, it’s just that the Rega is not embarrassed at all, and in the mids especially there isn’t much in it. All of this leads me to wonder whether the 222 is actually a rather good preamp (and that’s where the bulk of the money has gone) with less cost on the streaming side. Just a thought.
Would be interested to hear if anyone has tried an alternative streamer as a source.
I totally accept there are reflections and room effects and that things can happen which create a aural image.
Three events come to mind -
A performance of 1812 Overture, the snare drum at one point representing the advancing army. The percussionist played with a yellow duster folded over the top half of the upper skin. At each repeat of the phrase he moved the duster a little, the effect was as if the sound moved from the rear to the front of the hall.
A demonstration at a store, the requested speakers sounded awful. The dealer said that he had something far better, set up a pair of Epos ES14, from memory, the back and side walls about ten feet from the speaker, the room possibly ten feet to the ceiling. The amp was a Marantz PM4. I cannot recall what was being played but the image was massive, 3D, floor to ceiling wall to wall.
A demo at the Bristol Hifi Show, so standard hotel room, Audionote equipment, big Snell speakers litterally touching the side walls. Decca recording of Gilbert and Sullivan, walking the length of the room felt as if I was walking across the stage between the singers.
The first and last without a doubt using the room, the middle one, I cannot explain.
That’s a highly subjective impression for the record and not likely representaitve. I run my 222 with a 555 and there isn’t a TT I would prefer that doesn’t cost significantly more than what I currently have in my system. Some prefer the sound of vinyl playback to streaming. Not me.
Sure, but how many recordings are made with Blumlein? Other techniques (A-B, ORTF or just good old ad-hoc) introduce phase into all this, wouldn’t this allow various listening fx?
Dont misunderstand me, I’ve heard Blumlein done with just crossed fig8:s (and even soundfields) and loved it. But many people actually prefer the big open sound you get from carefully spaced omnis as in those old Proprius and Opus records.
Sure but the difference between an NDS and a Rega p3 isn’t really about that. The NDS is, dare I say, on a whole other level in all aspects I can come to think of regarding sq. Point is, if you can even compare the streaming part of a streamer to a Rega P3 it’s way below an NDS.
Yes that is interesting a right to the point. Namely that this game is so subjective it starts to become ridiculous. Ideals and preferences seem to make people’s opinions of what sound the best vary so much there is no longer a “better” objectively speaking. This is strange because it makes it impossible to produce products that are in fact better. The only way would be to produce products that are subjectively better to the employees of a particular company.
Have you tried a good turntable in your system? Say one at the price point of a NDX2
