Personally I think the current firmware is very good on the Nova.
I’ve not seen the sudden 100% volume issue some have noted but naturally this could be a concern.
You have to wonder if it’s the app not the firmware, and also there’s the ability to inadvertently alter a setting such as volume on any touch device.
It would presumably be feasible to build into the app some kind of safeguard against very dramatic volume increases such as a slow crescendo/decrescendo type effect or to have a confirmation dialogue of some kind for large sudden volume changes. (I’d add a custom setting to defet these safeguards too, then it’s clearly at the user’s risk.)
Whatever the cause the issue is compounded by the fact we’re controlling devices remotely, and the output device may be 20 feet away or even in another room, so those manual source changes where one would blast out due to higher output are less controllable by a physical knob when we’re stood many feet away! Not sure if that makes sense but suspect we’ve all at some stage gone from a low output to higher output source (or even with different tracks) and jumped due to the increase in volume.
It would also seem advisable not to alter max volume settings when music is playing, though I suspect I’ve done so in the past.
I also suspect many of us do not utilise the max volume setting to best effect to avoid such issues - default is around 85 from memory and I rarely play above 60/100. It might be better to have max volume of 50 and utilise more of the volume range from 0-100?
I assume you mean in the app - I think it’s often been slow to updatre changes unless you quite it and restart - for example when jumping back and forth between firmware versions at one stage it always reported the version reported by the streamer when you opened the app.
I wasn’t even near my phone that had the app running in the background. As I said I wasn’t using it at all to control music or my Atom it was started to update only . Not even sure if the app is active when it’s in the background and phone is in standby.
I was using Roon on my pc to control playback and volume. I reduced volume in the pc app and then it started to rise to 100pc, I turned unit off at mains as could not find remote to mute. It did the same thing again when restarted but I had muted before even trying anything. But I could see the volume level rising in mute. I then turned it off and went to bed. It’s not happened again but I have not had the need to use the Naim app so this might be the cause after all.
One thing that has struck me is that it’s pretty easy to jumo from app to app with the Uniti’s - I could start playing in Roon, then go to Qobuz on the iPhone and change what’s playing, then Amazon Music on iOS, Roon on iOS, Naim app on iOS to change volume, back to Roon and play something else…
Presumably only one app is ‘master’ at a time, but there might be a propensity for conflicts or unexpected interactions between them.
This is particularly true when we may be accessing different source streaming apps for different content - local NAS material, Roon material, Qobuz, Apple Music and Amazon Music for me, other will have Tudal etc. Even with Qobuz I’ll jump between NAS content for hi-res purchases and the app as my plan is CD quality streaming.
There must be so many variables that are unpredictable here, but if it becomes a recurrent theme for some users Naim need to investigate.
I’m just thinking along the lines of how many times I’ve accidentally phoned someone, sent a nonsensical text or inadvertently deleted an email due to accidental screen interactions on my phone - audio volume changes must be a real danger with touch devices.
Exactly. Especially considering that such volume „accident“ can damage hearing and speakers which can cost 5-20K Eur or more. Not counting stress and spoiled mood after such accident.
Some months ago I really cranked the volume up manually and for days was concerned I’d damaged the speakers, and my hearing was certainly a bit numbed for 24 hours as if I’d been to a loud arena gig without ear protection. The speakers now sound fantastic again, my hearing is what it is.
Most of the time these large volume increases probably don’t cause equipment damage, though I did once blow my SBL tweeters playing Marilyn Manson extremely loud when I was in a very morose mood - all manual volume adjustments at the time!
I can’t imagine Atom is capable of damaging speakers even at fill volume unless they are pretty low powered ones or you have an additional power amp connected.
I think damage is possible not because of power, but because of clipping. Clipping introduces huge uncontrollable forces on speaker drivers and I think drivers are not designed to handle this.
Well, there’s different worlds and user interfaces “coming together” here, as e.g. Alley_Cat commented:
Original HiFi volume control was physical with a knob standing in front of the unit. You could yank it around in a second, but everybody “knows” you don’t do this.
I think on purpose most classical remotes only allow only step-wise adjustment of volume.
Now, modern UIs in IT tool allow “absolute” control of volume. Which is pretty fine on a smartphone, typical PC speakers, and . Plus, there’s no “physical feedback” on those sliders and different devices have very different capabilities. (Keyboards, mouse, touchpad or screen, physical knobs, …)
Very difficult to predict, how it all works together; especially then the “code” between programs allows both relative and absolute settings of volume control. And if you integrate many protocols (as NAIM does here), you are not in control of how those 3rd party apps on a 3rd party protocol behave on different devices.
Of course each App should consider the circumstances, but how would they know on a smartphone, they are driving a power amp? Most Google Chromecast endpoints will be TVs, self-powered speakers (which a) don’t get that loud and b) are build as a unit, where amp and speaker roughly match each other), or something similar. Here, going to 100 quickly is a valid use case.
Question: why do you have something running “loose”, which has the power to destroy both speakers and hearing? I mean: in principal?
I for my part, set my Atom to max. 50; with that I typically use the range of 30-60, depending on source and situation.
You are right if viewed from app perspective. It would be hard to implement this volume checking in app side, because there are many apps and protocols as you said.
But it could be implemented in streamer side. No matter what app or protocol is used. Uniti Atom/Nova could check if the volume goes to 100 in one step some confirmation dialog could appear in the Atom’s/Nova’s screen.
Hmhh, there are reports above about “an increase of volume over some seconds until it reached 100”.
But for sudden jumps, this might be an option. (Should be a configurable option, IMHO. Otherwise people complain, they don’t get what they request via whatever remote App.)
And yes: for “powerful” devices, an incremental +/- logic on the remote is far more controlled, than a “set value X” with a 1cm slider on a touchscreen.
Absolutely agree on something like this being configurable, I think there’s a typo in one of my posts above along the same lines. Great to have ‘safety features’ but we should be able to use as we wish accepting small associated risks.
May be barking/miaowing up the wrong tree, but I don’t suppose anyone who saw a sudden increase in volume was using Airplay or the Android solution for Airplay - something that’s irritated me immensely with iOS/tvOS over the years is very poor granularity of audio volume control, and using Airplay from an AppleTV to Nova this has made me jump in the past as it (AppleTV) only seems to have 4 bit volume resolution or less so very easy to crank Airplay volume up from near zero to max within a second or two of pressing volume up on the remote.
Playing audio on iPhone too I was always annoyed via earphones/headphones that there was poor granularity with nothing in between a little too quiet and a little too loud - same with the digital volume on my car audio system grrr.
This is not a granularity or step increase as I for one did not move the volume up, I moved it down but in Roon not Naim app a few notches then it began to rise all on it’s own to 100% and nothing would stop it. Others I think it just started to climb without any interaction.