No apology required. It’s your club & your passion. As a 40 year ST holder you have my respect - you’ve lived through the ups and downs. I’m just interested to see if the Saudi’s can turn you into the next City (huge task imo) & whether Howe’s the man to compete with the like’s of Pep.
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Last season we won the NL with record points and record goals; undefeated at home all season etc. That team was lovely to watch and far better than this seasons team in multiple respects.
10 years ago we got 98 points and didn’t get promoted. That team was in many ways the match of last seasons team albeit far less attractive as the season wore on.
They wouldn’t hold a candle to the team which won the old division 4 in 1978. Arguably the greatest lower division team of all time according to some Shankly bloke.
The history books won’t show anything other than 2 of those 3 teams won titles.
It is utterly irrelevant whether your team can or can’t hold a candle to previous successful versions of your team. All thst matters is that a play off place is totally within your grasp right now. Far far worse teams go up every season.
If your team crawled over the line and then got to Wembley playing badly and won I’ve a sense you’d have zero joy in that moment and would only focus on a negative. Smell the roses.
I’m not sure I agree with several parts of that.
Money gives you the opportunity to be competitive. Revenue is indicative of nothing in terms of what a team ought to achieve.
When having these discussions it’s like all intelligent pre season discussion has been magicked away. Let’s remind ourselves of what 1 national newspaper wrote back in August.
“… following last season’s arguable overachievement in finishing fourth, a Champions League campaign could overstretch Eddie Howe’s squad. Indeed many Newcastle fans would not be surprised were the team to finish in mid-table following a campaign in which, despite the vast wealth of their Saudi Arabian majority owners, the club’s room for transfer market manoeuvre will be restricted by financial fair play…
… Newcastle are on an upward ascent and this is probably the season the climb becomes extremely arduous in places…
… the former Bournemouth manager has proved an excellent choice. After averting relegation in his first season, Howe’s second campaign featured unexpected Champions League qualification…”
I’m sorry but which bit of this season is “under-achieving”?
As regards the concept of “serial underachieving” I really do despair. 92 clubs and basically you get a shot at 2 maybe 3 cups and 1 title. In the EPL 4th place is now a trophy as are 7th and 17th. Assuming the latter idiocy isn’t the perspective taken elsewhere my calculations then suggest that only 21 clubs of 92 can be successful in any 1 season. Do the maths. Putting aside the weird ways that money can skew this your chances I wonder how many of the remaining 71 see themselves as serial underachievers. I suspect if we had an XG type stat. for league position or expected cup exit most would be achieveing, er, exactly what the stats. suggest.
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What I’m saying is our current team is the poorest we’ve had for some time and compared to the top six we will not be promoted this year. Leicester, Southampton and Leeds are far better teams.
True we have a mathematical chance of making the play offs and going up.
However, our form is too erratic and for major parts of games against the weaker teams we have played abysmally.
I go to matches to be entertained which does not necessarily mean gaining promotion. Along with the previous season we have continued our regression into a very average championship side offering poor entertainment and I have resigned myself to the fact things are not going to improve this year.
The ground is at least a quarter empty at the moment which means many others have concurred with my appraisal.
Our outlook is made bleaker by the fact we have incurred huge debts which further dampens enthusiasm for the current season.
Far better? They’re all good but all beatable. All would need a rebuild if they were to survive a promotion.
Time before last seasons promotion - 2003 - we were promoted despite spending August to January hovering between 15th and 12th. As the season nears its end some teams fly and some teams stutter. They’re not usually the teams who were flying and stuttering at the outset. Teams above you will lose games wholly against form. It’s obvious for example that Southampton will lose a game soon. Leeds away are beatable because your beloved Farke still refuses to address his very obvious tactical achilles heel.
We’re playing abysmally away from home and yet… 2nd place. All your points are valid but none of them absolutely mean what you want them to mean. I take your point re: entertainment but there are entertaining teams in your division - Blackburn spring to mind - who can’t even fill half their stadium. Your stadium is three quarters full.k I wonder if it had occurred that it being filled was always the exception and all you’ve done now is a reversion to the norm? That’s like our fans complaining last season when 10,000 was occasionally 9,000 something. Yes it’s a drop but mostly the norm for a long time was between 1,800 and 6,500. What you’re describing is a series of things which would give most fans cause for optimism and the reality is that most of your fans see that and are turning up.
You are steadily climbing when it matters. 2 points off a play off place with all to play for. You have a manager 1 season into a rebuild. You have the board member you wanted. You have experienced heads keeping things stable and some good youngsters coming through. Your stadium is 3/4 full.
I’m saying this because coincidentally I was in a meeting yesterday with 2 Norwich fans. 1 a season ticket holder and 1 not. Both described the above view. They both viewed any contrary perspective as being a minority perspective which gets too much air. It’s maybe time to step back and contemplate being optimistic?
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NUFC is a serial under achiever on the pitch. I’d be surprised if their own fans disagreed. This continues despite huge revenue & backing.
The issue for NUFC is can they turn themselves into consistent achievers. They should not be trailing Brighton and just staying ahead of AFCB. Everton is another under achieving club. My own the same. Continual bad appointments/mismanagement are to blame.
Does NUFC have the management team to deliver on their revenue stream? That’s the question for me. Rationalising underachievement is no way to achieve. I personally think NUFC need some star dust in the dug out if they’re to attract the quality of player they really need away from the big City clubs. It doesn’t matter to me of course, it’s just interesting. We, LUFC, always have enough problems of our own.
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I can assure you that my views concur with a great many of the Norwich fans I meet both at the ground and around the county. We’ve been fed “ a load of old squit” for far too long!
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There is no doubt that we are underachieving on the pitch this season. Anyone who says otherwise is wrong. The reason is injuries:-
Pope, Trippier, Botman, Targett, Burn, Anderson, Joelinton, Tonali, Longstaff, Willock, Barnes, Isak, Wilson. Ive probably missed some. All injured/unavailable at some point. In the summer, we spent £100m on two main signings (Barnes/Tonali) who we’ve hardly seen.
As for your views on Eddie, time will tell…
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The most difficult task at any club I tend to think is buying the right players/employing the right manager. We have a history of buying the wrong players/injury prone players. Man Utd are a classic example of a club buying the wrong players/employing the wrong managers and are arguably, £ for £, the worst run club in the EPL. Time will tell if you’re dealing with bad luck (I tend to think the club makes it own luck) or something more fundamental.
Based on the stats I’ve cited, most clubs are and likely always will be serial underachievers but only in the sense of not winning the small set of trophies on offer. it’s possible to support and love a club that have mostly won or done nothing.
There are other discussions to be had around expectation and revenue but I struggle with the idea Newcastle are in any sense underachieving this season. They are where knowledgeable experts thought they would be. The exceeding of expectations last season has created a foreseeable set of issues this season with last years levels being unsustainable this and compounded by expectations rising ludicrously fast and a set of injuries which are unfortunate but also predictable given the relatively small squad. Building a revenue base isn’t just about bigger crowds. It’s about product awareness and diversity. It will take about a decade to work and won’t impact on things like monies available for squad building for maybe another couple of years.
Looking at the bigger picture I have always found that single city clubs have nothing to temper their expectations in the way cities with 2 clubs do. The assumption tends to be that they have big crowds and thus are a big club. Clearly not the case. Have Newcastle under achieved in comparison to crowds and city size? Yeah to some extent. Then you start to compare to other clubs and cities and realise that statistically they’re a top of Championship/bottom of EPL club in every respect and thus have largely matched where they ought to have been. That all changes from now on. Putting aside the owned by a nation state stuff I tend to think good luck to them. The fans are mostly decent and they’ve a long standing commitment to attacking football. Let them challenge the boring top of the EPL. By itself that’s a good thing.
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I’m sure they do. They also don’t concur with the majority who turn up regardless and enjoy. Social media distorts views into extremes. Most fans occupy a middle ground of “well it’s rubbish but it’s our rubbish.” We choose what we believe; how we interpret facts and what we believe.
I want you to get some joy out of your team John. Try optimism.
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We’ll agree to disagree I suggest. Newcastle mindst, like Sunderland, represents a whole county I’d suggest and it’s that which gives them their big grounds rather than 1 club city status. Newcastle itself I believe is smaller than Nottingham and not much more than half the size of Sheffield a two club city with a terrific football heritage but little more than fond memories these days. Leeds of course is a rugby City. Colliers don’t have a footballer’s body shape.
Aye, I think EPL clubs can be discussed elsewhere. My focus this weekend is solely the FA Cup. Wrexham taking a ludicrous number to Blackburn and likely outnumbering home support Monday night. A pity really as this team really isn’t going through. I predict a heavy defeat.
I’m afraid a club in limbo is not a thing of joy.
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Magic goal for Maidstone 
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Born & lived in Maidstone for my first 23 years & have had a small, passing interest in Norwich City since then.
So, all-in all, a very satisfying first half!
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Maidstone have brought back the old cup magic. Hope they hold out.
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I can’t believe they did but have several reasons to be thankful they did.
Now for Liverpool & a perfect weekend!!
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What a fantastic result for the Stones! That’s the magic of the FA Cup!
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Apparently there were 4,000 Stones fans in the away end - twice their normal home gate! 