To support Edmund, I add another post from myself. 21 posts now.
Apart inviting them at our home, I don’t know what can be other options.
However neither me neither you Edmund are well placed for that, with our Ear Yoshino or Linn system.
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Hi @Edmund-of-Essex,
welcome, I think experimenting and trying is always the key to gain more ideas, understand your own preferences and pick what has the best result/price ratio.
Personally I like to try things even when I don’t intend to buy anything, just for fun and to get more reference points; so it’s pretty valuable all the time. I’ve listened to things that I ended up buying years later. Funny thing I didn’t even like Naim the first time I tried it and now my system is 100% Naim for the electronics, how funny.
A pity those XLR won’t be suitable for the experiment. I’ve only tried one cheap Chord cable (C-Stream for my ethernet) but I’m pretty confident those you mentioned sound sweet. Maybe, if you are willing to do so, you can arrange a demonstration with your system for your friend. Also you might have some spare power cables to let him try.
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Hi @frenchrooster ,
Thanks for joining in here! I do think encouraging people into appreciating ‘HiFi’ is tricky - most likely to produce negative outcomes. Your observations about my Linn system (and your Ear Yoshino) are perceptive. Walking into a room with such systems may not be particularly noticed by the casual observer (unless music is playing). Then, if elements of the system are pointed out, the typical reaction is confusion followed by lots of ‘What and Why’ questions, then by surprise and incredulity once answers are provided.
The situation I introduced in the first posting was the best summary I could provide and is not suggested as a ‘template’ to achieve success.
I think the engagement of new potentials (to HiFi) can best begin at a personal level.
In the first example it was simply chatting about my hobby and then subsequently (many months later) asking for help with some listening tests.
For others future potentials, it might be they already love listening to music, but have not appreciated how much influence equipment and other aspects determine the perceived listening experience. For such situations I do believe the Naim forum group have an opportunity.
For example, one could choose to loan them any spare equipment to enable them the experience. (Yes, I know this is what HiFi dealers do in the UK) but they have an ultimate interest to benefit from such loans).
I am not suggesting we all become Naim HiFi dealers - just to turn our attention from inwards (the Naim forum) to outwards - to see if we can spread the love (of excellent music replay)?
I have one more example:-
A few years ago nearby neighbour had a particular (non-optimum) arrangement of sound supporting with their flat screen TV. They are/were a jewellery designer and had a particular eye for creating aesthetic internal décor. I asked for their help in trying to chose the colour of the loudspeakers I was thinking of buying at that time (in 2019).
Through 2020 I continued with my media room project, finally replacing the flat screen TV which then became ‘spare’ in 2022. I offered the TV screen to the neighbour with specific suggestions and help to improve the supporting sound system. She accepted and has been over the moon with joy each time we meet.
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Sorry, just me rambling as usual!
I’m not sure at all how we encourage hi-fi uptake for younger people.
They have many more pressing concerns I think these days and will tend to go for mass market audio devices which may perform admirably.
Back in the day my main vices as a youngster/student were food, beer and hi-fi.
There was no need to budget for mobile phones/broadband and all manner of comparative luxuries such as Netflix.
A young chap working at a local bar is buying vinyl but doesn’t have a turntable. I’ve mentioned basic AudioTechnica as maybe something readily available and to consider but even that on the face of it seems unjustifiable to him.
Maybe it’s vinyl collection that’s important not playback, you just hope they don’t ruin those £20-30 purchases with a dire cheap turntable, but are they actually that bad? I still have plenty of LPs which sound great which were played on a crap Fidelity music centre with a 2p piece on the tonearm headshell to help tracking with ‘difficult’ pressings.
The thread title is a little obscure but makes sense once the post is read, I’m not sure I could do better 
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Hi Blacknote,
Sorry for my slow reply. Anyway ‘great minds do think alike’ as your suggestion of involving my friend in listening to my (Linn based) system was part of how he got more deeply involved and engaged with HiFi.
In case you missed the link (in the first post on the thread) I gave a reference to the set of experiments that I undertook with a Naim CI-102 in 2025 which I had set up as a competition with my Linn Klimax DSM3. I had asked my friend to give his opinion on both units…
On that day I took notes as he was giving his reaction for each play. I ran those tests using as much of my ‘masked’ trial method as I could. I’ll include the specific links to the relevant forum postings so that others can read the detail of my friends comments if they wish…
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Hi @Edmund-of-Essex,
no worries, take your time, we are not in a rush thankfully!
Involving people in the hobby is the main problem, the interest and emotional connection has to be created in the first place because most people can’t really conceive the idea that music reproduction can be different, better and more visceral. In most cases they are simply not exposed to that experience. One thing is listening to music, another is living the music itself. A good (but not necessarily super expensive) Hi-Fi system will give you that. A good example for me are also Rega and Q Acoustics… They sound fantastic for the price and, more importantly, they are emotional.
Personally I do appreciate the CI-102. It’s not the kind of gear I’m interested in, but I’m always curious and gave it a go with my speakers. I was very surprised for its performance. Does it have an excellent, detailed and open soundstage? Does it have that level of refinement? Surely not, but it bring all the Naimness (in class D) you need to start with and that is what makes it special. I wish it had a USB port to read USB drives, I don’t think it can. I would easily recommend it both as a first cheapish system and as a second system. I’m sure the experiment with your friend was pretty interesting and it’s fun to see others’ reactions.
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But why would you, or anyone else, want to do that? And why ‘ideally Naim (& Focal)’ products? Unless you work for Naim or sell it and have a vested interest.
It just seems an odd sentiment to express. Let people make up their own minds about what sort of sound they prefer and what system they want. Naim, as good as it is, isn’t for everyone. There are many really excellent alternatives. Best thing for your friend would have been to take him along to your dealer and get him to audition a range of alternatives. Maybe you have done this - you mention listening sessions.
If your friend is happy with his WiiM Pro Plus then who are you/we to judge? Lots of people, even though they may appreciate the sound of a top class system are nevertheless perfectly satisfied to listen to music at home on rather basic and cheap equipment. I don’t see why anyone would want to ‘convert’ them. Or do you suppose that because you love Naim equipment then other people should also love it and align themselves with your own preferences and priorities? Maybe I’ve misunderstood you somewhere, but as I say it does seem a most odd objective to adopt.
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Hi Edmund, I went through all these, but my sincere opinion is, just leave it and let your friend chooses.
I think fundamentally HiFi is a hobby. Nothing more than football vs driving vs hiking and so forth. We all experience differently and just choose what matters most to us.
I do have lot of friends going gigs together (apparently loving music) but zero interested in HiFi, among them are professional musicians and graphic artists.
Even comes down to HiFi there are different camps as well. Obviously most of us love Naim’s live-like performance. but there lot of those like the pipes & slippers.
Think I have listed enough reasons why someone may, or mat not into Naim, life is short just enjoy music and Naim and that is.
FWIW I managed to grant a huge discount of Nait 50 for my musician friend who swore he would buy it, but declined the last minute only because I didn’t show up in his latest performance.
You never know what people are thinking when it’s a hobby.
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This is a fascinating insight into one person’s buying ‘journey’. I notice your friend gained information by using internet searches and Youtube.
I find myself wondering what it would have taken to get him into a dealer and actually listening to a Naim Atom HE. Though perhaps he had decided that simply couldn’t afford it, so didn’t trouble a dealer and bought elsewhere.
Thank you for posting. It shows what manufacturers and dealers are up against when they are trying to shift stuff.
Chris
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A wonderful endeavour which nevertheless I have given up on. As posted elsewhere I now believe in saving our own kids first, get them underway with an understanding of better audio (and video and ICT) as part of the prepare-for-the-world package that we’d like to pass on.
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Hi Blacknote,
Thanks again for your observations. In a short while I’ll post some extra thoughts re the specific topic of this thread, but for this post I’ll ‘drift’ to support your observations re the NAIM CI-102.
When my friend and I tested the NAIM CI-102 in my home, only the preamplifier outputs were used. Power amplification was either a pair of Linn Solo 800 mono amplifiers or 2 channels of ATI 4005 (5-channel) power amplifier. Nevertheless I did share with the forum some extra assessments of the NAIM CI-102 (using its Class D power amps) on one of the threads that you also previously posted.
A link to that thread and my post is available here.
Hi @70sPete ,
Very many thanks for joining in and challenging the thread…
I guess, you could be right? However I think your next observation is interesting…
I personally do not think that (visiting a HiFi dealer) is necessarily the best way as a first step. As already noted (in post no 11) my wife (who is ‘into’ Hifi) observed that these places can appear ‘weird’ and ‘intimidating’.
I do plan to have another go at explaining this thread and fully answer your question of Why I (or anyone else) might want to do this.
In the meantime, perhaps it would be of interest for thread readers to know that the only NAIM HiFi equipment we use daily in our house is the Naim MuSo Qb Mk1 in our kitchen.
PS: We also use the main Linn system daily - but pre 2020 that main system comprised a Naim ND5 XS + Naim CD + Naim integrated amplifier system.
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With music and Hi Fi, i believe it is best to let others find their own way forward. Sometimes somebody will hear a good system and develop an interest, sometimes they will continue with low res Spotify.
Most people do not worry much about sound quality.
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Lossless now, and if you don’t know hifi also surprisingly good with Apple AirPods, but yes I know what you mean and I share the sentiment.
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Hi @Edmund-of-Essex,
welcome! I do remember that post as not many people have seriously considered the CI-102 (pity because it’s lovely for what it is).
True, I wonder how they can’t be moved by a more emotional / visceral music reproduction. The problem isn’t that they might be not be buying Hi-Fi gear, the problem is that they don’t show a real connection witth music in my view. And that goes much deeper than just listening to music in general.
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Hi @Edmund-of-Essex and thanks for your reply.
I have to agree with you about dealers. Yes they can certainly appear weird and intimidating, even for experienced hi-fi customers. This was even more so back in the late 70’s I think when the whole Linn/Naim thing was in full swing. I have seen customers literally ushered out of the door because they were more interested in buying a large pair of speakers than a LinnLP12! I don’t often visit dealers these days but walking into one always puts me in mind of those scenes in a film or TV program when a stranger walks into a pub and suddenly the whole place falls silent and everybody stares!!!
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I truly understand and share your feeling, but the exact same thought sounds arrogant and geeky to outsider and keep people from HiFi and music enjoyment.
After all we all listen differently – just because a guy likes football doesn’t necessarily to be a fan of a certain football club.
I agree with Nigel1957 most people just don’t care. My girlfriend doesn’t even know who sang Don’t Look Back In Anger but virtually listens to it on Spotify everyday. But what’s good to me is, she keeps a sanity in music playback, when she thinks a system sounds good it’s always very good.
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We must not forget that even relatively cheap gear sounds very good today. I do a lot of headphone listening, and the distance between my Astell& Kern personal audio with IEM’s and my SPL Phonitor with €2000+ headphones is not huge. I enjoy listening to music on both.
In my small city, we do not have a HiFi dealer anymore. The last one to shut never stocked stuff I was not interested in, and the one I used until he retired ten years ago was a good chap who was not intimidating, but that was before prices started to hit the stratosphere.
This very forum like other forums can be intimidating at times. Discussions about €20,000 cables and how they will transform your system, that probably cost more than a small house, might induce a form of inadequacy, in somebody dipping their toes into the Hi Fi world. Idem for HiFi mags, that seem obsessed with hyper expensive gear.
My “Pauper Fi” XS3 with a set of PMC bookshelf speakers sounds pretty good. I understand that a big system in a proper listening room is sublime, but my stuff is not far off. The perceived price of entry ino the HiFi world is a thing that puts many people off.
Remember the sound quality at most concerts is piss poor. The exception is Classical music in the right hall.
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You won the lottery in 2020? 
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@juliushui I’m glad you understand my thoughts, but why would that be considered arrogant? That’s absolutely far from my intentions. Geeky might be. I would consider it just as a statement about what I’ve seen around. We all perceive music differently, what does surprise me is that so many people don’t seem to care about it too much, it’s just used to fill empty moments.
The fact is that football is an active choice, something that you have to do with some willingness. Music is based on our inner senses, so technically you just sit and listen to it passively. So the fact that it’s passive and so universal makes me wonder why so many don’t get caught by it.
One of my friends (millennial) bought a cheap system (with Klipsch speakers), I think it sounds good for the price. He likes to have it but hardly ever use it despite being in the living room. So from one extreme to the other.
By the way I highly respect everybody’s choice, whether they care or not about music. But I do find strange this general lack of interest. And it’s not the Hi-Fi world, it’s music in the first place. If you want to enjoy it properly, you don’t necessarily need to spend a fortune (as @Nigel1957) , there are some great little systems around.
She got used to your system, you spoilt her!
Well some expenses are just out of this world and, despite understanding them in the context of Hi-Fi, I can’t really justify them for the law of dimishing returns. However people worries so much about prices in the Hi-Fi world… but what about other hobbies and interests? Many are equally or more expensive. The easiest (and more popular) is cars. I don’t hear people complaining or being worried about that, I suppose it’s more acceptable.
Unluckily I have to agree, I do prefer listening to music with my system. I go to concerts only for the live experience as you get a different view about the artist and his or her performance.
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