I think that’s not entirely fair, or indeed entirely accurate - Naim have been very up front here and have been working very hard to try to fix an issue that has not been so easy to nail down, I would guess because there are so many variables involved. Naim has responded quickly in most all cases and took the step of greatly expanding the beta group in order to try to increase the likelihood of an incident.
Everyone has been kept up to date on progress whether by me or by Clare or Tom (although no details of the ins and outs of the beta testing, except for those in the beta group, for obvious reasons) and as previously mentioned, we are now in the final straights of Roy doing final sound quality testing before giving the green light for general release.
Richard I think it is perfectly accurate. There is a problem that has existed since August of last year that your engineers have not been able to fix. Naim have not been upfront at all. You have not told us why we can’t downgrade to the last known “good” version, and claire herself keeps repeating the “we are getting closer” message until we are all bored with it. How about telling us really what happened, and what the core issue is and we might be a little more understanding. Remember that there are a lot of software engineers on this forum, we truly know what issues can happen, but to accuse us of not being fair is to be disingenuous
There are many ways of using the equipment, and communicating with it. Tidal, qobuz, Bluetooth, chromecast, airplay, roon raat, wifi or wired, local storage over a network, usb, screen on, screen off etc etc etc. My unit has never skipped a beat, rebooted, frozen the screen. So many variables and they all need to be tested, which is why the beta group is needed as hopefully all those variations in set up and test conditions will be covered. But not necessarily. Does one roon user have the same setup as another? Possibly. The software team at Naim is also pretty small. This is not a simple fix.
I have mentioned a number of time previously that downgrading firmware is not something that should be done without a degree of caution and some hand-holding from Naim - so the best place to discuss that is with Naim support. Quite apart from that I’m sure that some streaming services may make downgrades not as straightforward as you might think.
I’m not a software engineer so couldn’t possibly begin to give you detail of what the issue might have been. But if you ask, and you genuinely really wish to know, then once it’s fixed I’m sure Naim will let you know what was causing the problem.
Just for the record, which Naim streamer are you currently using and what issues have you been experiencing so far?
Nice deflection. All information is available on my profile, but I am happy to elaborate and answer the question. I waited two years for a 272 replacement that never happened so I bought a dCS Bartok three weeks ago. What made me pull the trigger was this software issue. I figured that even if naim fixed the issue it would delay any new products by months even years. No denying naim make great amps, I love my 300DR, but for anyone looking to replace their 272 just go buy a dCS Bartok, it is an amazing product. I bought a Nova as a second system last August and a condition of sale was that it hadn’t been upgraded to 3.5. I found one still running 3.4 and it is a great unit. No issues on 3.4. What has riled me the most in all of this is the content of communication from Naim to the wider community. Software releases go wrong, yes we get that. Rollbacks to last known working versions are often a solution. So Richard or Claire for all those people out there having issues, answer this question specifically “Why can’t anyone experiencing issues roll back to 3.4?”
You seem to be getting unnecessarily confrontational here. It’s only a software issue. Naim are working on it so perhaps you should cut them some slack.
I don’t know, as I posted above it’s something that’s usually considered on a case by case basis, as it’s not quite so straightforward - who did you ask at Naim about rolling back for your Nova?
And by the way, you accuse Clare of “woeful” communication in your post above and yet it was only recently that you were thanking her for being “so responsive” on this very thread. As I say, your post read as not entirely fair, or entirely accurate.
Yes you are right @anon4489532. Not my intent, have been on the sidelines mostly since this whole thing started last August. Just seeing one more post from naim saying a fix is around the corner set me off. If it had only been going on a few weeks I would not have arc’d up. But really Naim customers deserve better than we are getting. Whether we are directly experiencing a problem or not. I’ll put my keyboard away now. I think google SEO has enough
I echo responsiveness, but the messages are a bit wishy-washy at times… there’s been no timeline handed out, most recently with the “release ETA” both for this update and with things like Tidal Connect. Even just stating whether we can expect it in the coming days, weeks, Q2, or so forth would be handy. I appreciate these are uncertain times and software always throws issues at you, but having some time-based idea of when we can expect updates/fixes would be certain to quash a few thoughts.
Considering a lot of us on these forums claim to have some form of software development prowess, I would give a third option along the lines of “we plan for a release in the next few weeks, provided testing goes accordingly” and then with Clare et al being responsive we are kept in the loop over the course of those weeks - if something unexpected does happen, a little note of a push-back “due to X reason” would be all I’d look for!
Have to agree with someone complaining either way though!
I’d suggest there are rather too many people who seem to think they know better than Naim! Of course it’s taken ages, and it’s a mild nuisance for some, but as someone who is part of the beta group I know all the stuff that’s come up and unfortunately it’s more complex than many appreciate. Sometimes it’s almost as though people have nothing better to do than moan. Better to take longer and get it right than to release a half baked solution - all that achieves is people having another go at a Naim and accusing them of all sorts of shortcomings.
Yep - I wholeheartedly agree with taking a short while longer and getting it right. A little more transparency on the things that come up, or even just an estimated time frame, is all I’d be eyeing for - I can’t begin to speculate on those that are cleverer than Naim though!
To chip in with @Mrpseudonym I’ve also been critical but far more constrained than the reality of the situation would justify. Our new NDX2 in October is not able to play anything over 24-bit 48Khz unless freshly rebooted and exhibits appalling and variable lip sync issues on a Toslink feed. Its effectively been a brick. I wish we had the old NDX back. To add to the mix, the email into support has been ticketed but unreplied to so I cross every digit possible that someone has actually looked at the ticket and its a known issue and due to be fixed.
Due to an unintended and unique set of circumstances, the NDX2 hasn’t been paid for yet and our dealer knows that if this isn’t fixed it and the Nova we bought around the same time are going back. I’m done with Naim digital front-ends. But live in denial that they can get their act together. I want them to succeed but…
I suspect these issues are symbolic of wider cultural and organisational issues.
Zebedee, I’m sorry to hear that about your experience with your NDX2. Is it currently with your dealer or back at Naim? This sounds like it may not be a firmware issue, but something else, if it cannot play over 24/48 and has variable lip sync issues. If you let me know the ticket number, I’ll get Naim support to look into it. I’ll message you.
