Hi Hollow,
How can you survive on only 400 albums?
Rip
Tidal! And I listen to the radio a lot! Or are you being sarcastic?
No sarcasm intended. For myself, I don’t find Tidal good enough to replace my locally stored files, and I would be worried about building a library which could suddenly disappear if the host went out of business. I also have a copy of my library in a holiday home which has no internet access. So I have 2,400 albums in my local storage…
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So if one of the reasons to upgrade to a new ND unit was to ‘future proof’ yourself against newer formats with bit depth greater than 24 & sampling frequencies greater than 192KHz, you are saying that when presented with these, the SQ from a newer ND Streamer is not up as good with 32-bit formats as 24-bit handling?
What about 24/384 & DSD128?
I let Roon downgrade to a max of 24/192 & DSD64 to my NDS, so I can play the PCM 24/384, DSD128 & DSD256 formats I have.
I am saying that my DAC uses SPDIF and that transport format is limited to 24 bit PCM. Bit depths greater than 24 bit for rendering are not relevant to me, and are inappropriate anyway with our current understood hearing anatomy and current recording methods, replay equipment and methods. Greater than 24 bit for modification is absolutely relevant … but rendering at 24 bits is more than sufficient… I am saying that the decimation algorithm ‘sounds better’ being performed in the Roon Core rather than the Naim transport. I let my Roon Core undertake subtle eq tasks, therefore RAAT simply conveys the rendered PCMwithout further decimation being required… a real benefit of Roon.
With regard to your seperate Statement about DSD, remember your NDS has to convert those DSD rates to PCM using the in built processor in preparation for the internal PCM DAC , but DSD is about sample rate as opposed to bit depth in this context … remember DSD has a 1 bit sample depth, and I was referring to 24 bit as used by PCM… or DoP transport framing. Although I only have a few DSD 64 recordings and very fine they are, I would not expect DSD128 or DSD256 to work over standard SPDIF… as the transport rate would be too high… but I have not tried 128 or 256.
So yes if I had lots of DSD128 and DSD256 recordings I might want to use an alternate solution, and probably want to use a native Delta Sigma DAC as opposed to the PCM1704K to get the best from them
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Given the similar SHARC processing architecture in the ND555 to your NDX2, I imagine this would be the same for the ND555.
I have been unable to get DoP of DSD64 working over S/PDIF into my NDS. If I try this path all DSD64 needs to be preconverted to PCM.
Now through the UPnP Bridge DoP of DSD64 working fine and the internal processing introduced a couple of years in the NDS firmware works just fine. I have a few hundred DSD based recording, 771 coming from SACDs, but only 12 at the higher double and quad DSD levels. Given I don’t see this as a mainstream recording or mastering process over DXD, I am happy to allow Roon to downconvert the DSD128 or DSD256 to DSD64 and present them over DoP.
What’s interesting is the interesting to discover is that the higher format support in the new Naim streamers are just results of the SHARC based processing used in the later Streaming board and no changes to the DAC processing. So if you are converting off board, there is no difference to the NDS vs ND555.
Bizarre, I really enjoy DSD64 over my NDX2 into my Hugo… and my Hugo decodes it as DSD64 … and to be fair my NDX previously did this as well.
Therefore I would check your media server and ensure it’s actually sending as DSD64… what does your NDS say on its screen?
Also check your NDS digital out is set at native. Perhaps your DAC can’t extract DSD from DoP?
Didn’t quite follow your other point… the transport architectures are very different between the NDS and the ND555 (and NDX2 and ND5XS2) … its the DAC and analogue output stages that are largely unchanged, but tweaked and optimised further with the ND555.
The Analog Devices SHARC processor is not much to do with the Naim Streaming Card (streamer network transport)… its on the ‘digital board’ and it’s part of the digital DAC reconstruction processing used for digital outs or oversampling and low pass filtering for the DAC chip(s). I can’t remember exactly from the detailed ND555 design presentation I had at Naim, but I think the ND555 uses a more powerful and more recent AD processor.
Ahh - my issue is DoP into the NDS over S/DPIF not out from the NDS.
It was just that at the heart of the important processing the heart of the ND555 is largely the same as the NDS, the additional formats supported are as a byproduct of the more powerful SHARC processor.
Is this part of the processing chain not within the Faraday cage and therefore not part of the Streamer processing and not the DAC & output stages?
But boy do the changes from the NDS to the ND555 make a night and day difference.
Exactly… hence why I say the importance of the streamer transport, and the new streamers are a major step forward seemingly both in our opinions.
Do you find any issues with HDD in Innuos as opposed to SSD as recommended by Roon, planning on getting Innuos mini myself
Does it make sense to spend so much money on the Naim DAC component just to effectively bypass it and replace it with the Hugo DAC? The Naim DAC costs (much) more than the Chord, so what is the point? You are also not using a lot of the Naim power supply that you’ve paid for to power the DAC.
I wouldn’t suggest that the small part of the Naim box you are using is just a raspberry pi, but the waste of money on the unused components would certainly nag at me.
It even spoils the aesthetic because you have to have the Chord DAC on the rack amongst the Naim boxes.
well its all about what sounds best for the user. Remember with the streamers - especially the new streamers, the major advancement is the Naim specific transport and digital section. As you are probably aware with the new streamers you can only run in digital mode or analogue mode - but not both - I assume configuration and implementation is then optimised for the job in hand; ie to feed an external DAC or use the bundled DAC.
I just bought a NDX2 a month ago and started using Roon my an old ND5-XS earlier this year. Last night I set up a NUC, so I think I am at hardware/software game for now on this, but still playing with configuration/options.
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What hardware hosts your Roon Core
Intel NUC (NUC8i7BEH) with Samsung 970 EVO 250 GB NVMe M.2 SSD for the OS, 8 GB RAM, and a Samsung SSD 860 EVO 1TB SATA III SSD for audio file storage -
Do you use Roon Rock?
Yes, using ROCK -
Where is you Roon Core located?
I am trying two locations. Away from the system in home office, and also on an auxiliary rack next to the system. -
How is your Roon Core connected to your streamer?
Ethernet with Cisco 2960 Gigabit switch(es). With the office location it’s via two 2960 switches connected with 100’ of Cat 6. In the listening room location, both NDX2 and NUC are on the same switch.
Another question I would have liked to have seen is what DSP settings are people using. I have a Gen 8 i7 version of the NUC so I assume that with the GPU should support the full range of DSP processing in Roon. I still need to figure out if I want to run native mode (no DSP), or full on DSD128 upsampling, and if the latter what paramaters are optimal for the NDX2.
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If you are referring to the ‘DSP’ tone controls… then the secret is to only use if you really need, and then as subtly as you can.
I simply use mine to sharply attenuate a room resonance at around 60 Hz by using a notch filter.
I run my Roon Core Server on my iMac, and it happily runs in the background even when the iMac is in standby. The most intensive processing is when eq changes are applied to DSD media, and even this hardly tickles the iMac. The DSP is not really demanding for any small modern day PC with floating point CPU support which just about all have. (The days of needing maths co processors belongs to the early 90s, though some small NAS processors might struggle here) It has worked flawlessly and transparently over the last 6 months
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I also have quite a large library, but find the SQ from Qobuz comparable in many cases
Sure, it’s something else on top of everything else we have to take on board when we switch to streaming, but when you figure it out it enhances things in all sorts of ways. Going back to the Naim ap to demonstrate how the Roon Nucleus outperforms the NAS is a very unpleasant experience…
Does your Roon Nucleus outperform your NAS in terms of SQ?
I have started to use a little DSP to counter act that brightness of my Atom that I can’t seem to get rid off. Only a slight Parametric EQ reducing 1khz and 3khz down a smidgen. I have found the upsampling makes no difference with Naim gear. It did when I used my Arcam DAC prior to getting the Atom.
I will be embarking on full Roon correction soon though as I think my Room is the major contributor to the Atom sounding off and I cant treat it any more than I already have. Ordered an UMIK-1 will use REW to perform the analysis and likely get homeaudiofidelity to create convolution filters that I can use in Roon.
Using Homeaudiofidelity is fantastic. I’ve been using it for my difficult room for well over a year.
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