I havent read every message in this post, apologies if my ‘question’ has been answered/clarified.
I’m looking for a streamer too, possibly with an inbuilt DAC (but possibly not). What is going through my mind is there seems to be two forms of ‘streaming’ - one is using an online service (Qobuz, Tidal et al), another is streaming from a NAS.
A lot of the physical kit is shared (network cables, switches, streamer, DAC) between the two forms.
Is the consensus that a quality streamer will have the same benefits in both forms of music delivery? (This NOT a question about NAS vs internet!).
An Innuos Zen Mini might be worth looking at. Streamer with cd ripper and internal HDD/SSD and a decent DAC.
We found that it does. A good quality streaming transport is important.
Older naim offerings such as the NDS were optimised for local playback. Newer streamers have improved the quality of internet streams.
A well designed streamer, with good isolation and PSU design, will improve SQ across both local and internet sources (whether naim or not).
Having said all that, we found most benefit from separating streamer and DAC into separately powered boxes connected only by SPDIF. This, in our system and to our ears, has removed the need for any extra switches or exotic network cabling. Both local and internet sources sound excellent.
Leema Elements Streamer
A Lindemann Network2 might be a nice streamer/DAC solution for the Nait 50, plus, one can add an Apple Superdrive to its USB port and then you have a nice sounding CD player to boot.
While I love my ND5XS2, I have also compared it to my Network2, and there really is a fairly close race as to which one I prefer. Too close to call. Both players compared into Nait XS3, FWIW.
@Frazeur1 Very limited US dealer network. I found one dealer in Oregon. Can you confirm that this Network 2 will work on an Eero wireless network? And confirm that it does not require a separate DAC? I love the idea of plugging my Apple drive into the USB to play CD’s! If this works, it will be a lot of fun.
Many thanks.
Yes the lindeman network works either wired or via WiFi, and yes it works without a dac. In fact it only has line out, no digital output is provided.
The Lindemann Limetree Network 2 streamer does look very interesting. Punches above its weight according to reviews. Small and can be hidden away (no screen). No digital out on the V2 but V1 does if you have your own DAC. Would be interesting to hear one and compare with Lumin D2.
Apparently this Lindemann uses the Stream Unlimited Stream 810 module… which I think is also the basis for the Naim gen 2 platform. Cool.
edit: Hans Beekhausen video review showed the internals. The price for the one with DAC (Limetree Network II) seems to be about €1000 vs about €900 for the non-DAC version (Limetree Bridge II). So maybe there is a market for high quality, small form factor network appliances after all??
edit2: the attachment of an external CD-ROM via USB raises the question of whether Naim will eventually/ever add this feature to the Atom and Nova, as was originally announced in the pre-release days. If it’s built into the Stream 810 board functionality, maybe the sdk exists for the integration?
Skip-as others have mentioned, it does work on both wired and wireless, I am currently using mine wireless with Spectrum Internet and their router. And yes, limited US dealer network for sure. I also bought from the dealer/distributor in Oregon.
The Network2 has a built-in DAC, which I think is very good, the Bridge2 as mentioned, has no DAC. I have both for two different applications, and both are very good and fill those needs where small form factor, yet great sonics are needed.
The added ability to add an Apple Superdrive or equivalent, is just icing on the cake, while I do not spin a lot of CD’s these days, it is a nice option to have, and I too, do not understand why more of the DACs with USB haven’t taken advantage of this, even Naim. It just works well, and I am totally pleased with the sonics.
Really, the Lindemann gear has impressed me in a very good way all around, and the Source2 and Power2 amplifiers intrigue me as well, and they come at a price that isn’t terrible by any means these days, especially when you look around and see what you get with other brands. FWIW…
Anyone mention a LUMIN D2 streamer? Not quite shoe box in size but in chrome it will match nicely, plus it sounds fabulous and has a good app.
If you could be pick up a used Lindemann V1, with the AKM chip, you also have the option of converting PCM to DSD, were that to be of any interest. Always been happy with mine, though it’s resting right now, after I got a Cary DMS-650.
Earlier in the thread I suggested an Innuos Zen Mini Mk3. I’m using mine with my NAIT 50
I get access to my library of 900 CDs all ripped to FLAC by the Zen. I get Radio Paradise, Qobuz (HighResAudio and Tidal are also available but I use neither) plus general internet radio.
I now have it running via USB into the ridiculously dinky SMSL SU-1 which, for the princely sum of £56 has given me full MQA and DSD512 decoding.
I just listened to Muse’s MQA re release of Origin of Symmetry and it blew my socks off.
It remains to be seen whether the SMSL offers any significant upgrade over the Zen Mini’s internal DAC for general 44 - 96 PCM but it’s a great way to try out some of the more esoteric formats (now that MQA is dead in the water I’m hoping for some fire sales).
The NAIT takes it all in its stride.
*Photo for illustrative purposes, it doesn’t live there permanently
The text on Naim’s website says of the (3rd Gen?) 333:
“the NP800 streaming card, an exclusive DSP with integrated crossover…”
Are the NP800 and 810 module different?
According to Steve Sells the 222 uses the 800 board as the 810 is different, and not suitable. I would assume the same applies to the 333.
I am not Steve Sells, obviously, but since the 800 board is not listed as a commercial product on the Stream Unlimited site, it might be reasonable to guess that it’s more like a custom / proprietary board for a major development partner such as Naim.
That said, in spite of any incompatibility or detailed version-level differences between (proprietary?) 800 and (commercial?) 810 boards, the broad point I was trying to make is that Lindemann has chosen the same streamer supplier as Naim… which I was taking as a positive sign since we all know and love what Naim has built around the Stream Unlimited technology.
Sorry for over-reaching and erroneously saying it was the same board: I didn’t recall the 800 vs 810 discussion that @ChrisSU cites (thanks!). I can’t find online info about the differences - which could be minor level, such as form factor or power supply requirements, or major, such as enhancements to input noise rejection, output noise floor, clock stability or whatever else you might imagine makes one streamer board better than another when engineered into a chassis as part of an overall HiFi product. If Naim had input into the design process, you can imagine they’re happy with the customization in the birds being built to their spec.
Thanks for the extra info. I was very interested to hear positive reactions from people who’ve tried the Lindemann network streamer and/or DAC. For my part, I’m delighted with what I’m hearing from the stand alone Uniti products.
IIRC, Naim may have worked with that supplier to make a proprietary NP800 board, which is why neither of us could see it online.
That’s probably what ‘an exclusive DSP’ refers to in the Naim quote in my post above.
If so, the NP800 has been designed to have a particular effect on SQ (especially in Naim systems).
The NP800 is not a technical feature that any other manufacturer offers.
[I hope not too many birds were used in the production process! ]
The stream800 info is still available if you look. Many companies use the boards from streamunlimited, it’s a bit like using an intel board. Dcs use it, I think Cambridge audio ….
Also “np” was short for “new platform” which at the time was just factory speak for atom/star/nova. In other words, they incorporated the new platform streaming module as a core component. Compared with whatever the old one was inside unitiqute etc. The dedicated test area was known as new platform, the other area was “classic”.
There’s probably a new nickname now.
This is likely the important bit:
Common sense at last.
A bit off topic, but anyway…,
2017 Google buys 41 percent of Austrian IT company StreamUnlimited
The Viennese company … works with companies such as JBL, Insignia, Onkyo and Panasonic, among others, which have integrated „Google Assistant“ technology into their new smart speakers.
StreamUnlimited emerged in 2005 from a development team of the Vienna-based Philips Audio Video Innovation Center. Between 2001 and 2004, the team developed the first streaming devices for audio and video clips, the first MP3 players, DVD recorders and early products supporting HDMI and Wi-Fi technology.