The Naim app is so janky

Streaming Audio
82

Odd that you’d turn this into a discussion
about word choices rather than comment on the points made.

I’ll bite though… I just Googled the definition of janky and the first example of use is about software, so it seems a great choice based on my experience with the (poor quality) app.

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I’m talking mostly about human computer interaction and poor user interface design. At no point have I said it doesn’t work, or mentioned network issues. Compared to well designed mobile apps - Spotify, Google Maps, Slack - the Naim app is dire. It’s subjective for sure, and that’s a high bar, but for such a high end product, I’d expect a lot more.

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83

Your the one who used the term “janky” and invited comments. It’s an odd term to use, as far as I am concerned.

As far as the definition goes, “extremely unreliable quality” I think this is a poor term to describe the app based on how many people are happy with using it.

Time to move on.

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84

Please be aware that we are not all native English speaking persons …

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85

I think we were probably all replying in the context of this statement. Those of us who don’t have lag and don’t get hit by the bugs you see will comment on that. As you can see there are different views on the UX. I’d be quite happy to have a single search to let me look for music across online sources and my NASes, but actually the way the Naim app works pretty much matches my way of searching for music so it suits me.

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86

Agree. App is God-awful. Used to dread showing off my kit in case it crashed which it usually did at some point. Come on Naim, sort it!

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87

Has anyone else noticed that, on an iPhone when adjusting the volume, if you are not precise with your finger movement the slider zips to the left and mutes the music?

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I find it very frustrating that if you know you have a certain album but don’t know wether it’s on your NAS or Tidal you have to search both the library’s. Why both merge both of them? And they can take more advantage with NAS or Tidal albums.

I’m somebody who really can’t remember artist’s names but if I see a little part of a cover I know that’s the album I’m looking for. Unfortunately the Naim app can’t find the most album covers of my albums on my NAS or they are wrong.

Also the UI is very outdated and ugly in my opinion. There’s now way to edit album covers. There’s now way to edit things at all. I hoped that I would get used to it but it’s a real struggle to find what you looking for if you don’t know the exact names of all that albums in the library. There are a lot of people that can but I can’t.

This is the reason that I use Roon instead of the Naim app. Now Roon, that’s something else! In all good ways in my opinion. Almost every album is found with all the good covers and it makes now difference if it’s on the NAS or on Tidal. You can even add the Tidal version of a album if you have it on the NAS and you’ll see only the primary version in your library and can be chanced. Almost everything can be edited if you want. The UI looks great and I can on and on…

Unfortunately my NAC-272 isn’t Roon ready and is not going to be in the future so I’m using my Mac Mini to run the Roon server but still saving money to by a Metrum Acoustics Ambre to use as a Roon bridge/endpoint.

I love the Naim sound and love the design of it but the app I find awful …

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89

I totally agree. The Naim streamers rely on the outdated Naim app or Roon to work - The same apps apply to an entry-level streamer right up to a £15k ND555.

I know of at least two 500 range owners (who must have spent £60-100,000 on Naim kit) that have now sold it all and gone to another high end marque. They both stated it was because of the poor Naim app and its low level integration with the kit. The same applies to Roon - “Roon Ready” but can’t control volume without a degredation in sound quality (32bit issues?). A £500 “Roon Ready” streamer has better integration than an ND555!

Given Naim made £30M operating profit in 2018 (last published set of accounts), they have enough in the bank to improve the equipment embedded code-base and its SDK (software development kit and then outsource the app development to a decent provider. Plenty in the market that could do a great job compared to what exists now.

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90

I have an ND555, Nova and Mu-So and (touch wood) dont have any problems. For me the app works fine and I use it with Tidal. Only issue I have is not being able to play direct from Tidal but now I never go direct always via naim app so not really a problem after all… I use Apple products as hardware.

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91

My experience is fairly good - I’n using an NDX 2 and the app is installed on a latest gen iPad Pro. I mainly use internet radio stations and Qobuz, and both seem to work well. I have had to re-install the app once, since last October, and have had consistent performance - albeit with the frozen display (on the player) showing a previous content…!

I’m afraid that gone are the days when the hardware was “king”…unless you’re running analogue such as turntables etc, the software engineer is now the driver…you can spend whatever you wish on modern digital tech…but if the software is problematic then you can be in a world of hurt whatever the quality of the hardware!

I’m absolutely certain that those nice folks at Salisbury are supremely aware of this…and will be doing their utmost to ensure that all their hard work and effort in giving us great products won’t be negated by the software. But it does take time, and every change risks problems for some customers.

Its really the only thing that worries me about the viability and long term usability of purchases audio, photographic and AV in the digital domain. If only everything was as reliable and long lasting as my Leica M lenses…used on an M film body they will last almost indefinitely, but they are purely mechanical optical in nature and have no electronics save for a code that tells the camera body what lens profile to use (on modern digital bodies. When the software works well we are all smiling, but alas when problems occur its not like…swapping out the arm or cartridge on one’s turntable is it…?

Fingers crossed for all who have experienced difficulties and best wishes and stay safe everyone.

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92

I think you’ll find Naim’s total sales were around £30m not the profit. Profit is around £2.5m in 2019 and I think quite a bit less in 2018. Nevertheless, not an excuse for the app.

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You are correct. Latest set of lodged accounts:

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Any development is part of Operating Costs and therefore comes out of Gross Profit, so the impact on the bottom line is less. (The next set of accounts might see an impact of the sub-assy supply issues on turnover and profit eg: DR modules.)

If Naim do not address the app issue, they will lose market share across all product lines because the app is used across them all. Conversly, I think more mainstream product lines like Muso and Atom, etc would be impacted worse, because the end user expectations are higer - they would compare it to Spotify, Sonos, etc.

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I don´t know what janky means in plain english, but I find the Android Naim App lacks a lot in terms of usability and reliability. And for me it´s frustrating not having a Windows App, the Samsung Android mobile is not the best tool to organize, find and select albums and other sets of music.

Someone said that the app works fine when the network is fine, so my network should be a mess, because I struggle with the NDX2 w/o remote that i´m testing and mine Qute2 to make them play Tidal, my NAS ripped CD´s and iRadio.
Playing one Tidal album till the end, looking for another, and play it afterwards it´s a nigthmare, normally it´s necessary to return to Home or playing iRadio and then returning to Tidal.

The good news for me is that with the last firmware update the refusals to play certain Tidal albums disappear, and with the new router the Tidal dropouts are past history.

So, why not a Windows App with or without a Android one ?

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I don’t get these massive sweeping statements about the app and the effect having an imperfect app will have on peoples perception of the brand overall.

Why should Naim users, who predominantly buy Naim equipment for ‘the sound’ not ‘the app’ sell their gear and move to Sonos simply because the app doesn’t meets their needs perfectly. Or when comparing the Naim app to the Sonos app, they think the Sonos app is better, therefore regardless of the sound, go to all the trouble making a loss on their Naim gear, only to buy a less inferior HiFi equipment, with regards to the sound, or the way the sound makes them feel.

What, sacrifice an emotional connection to the music for a slicker or less janky app?

There must be tens of thousands of app users out there, this thread shows up 20-30 users where it really pisses them off.

The app was created with one fundamental purpose, to allow the user to search their digital music library, select a piece of music and play it through their Naim box. Weirdly, I manage to be able to do this every time I want to listen to music, 100% and I can change the volume and I can search my library.

With regards to other features, like a better search function, a volume slider, locking the screen, etc. These are first and foremost user features that may or may not enhance the user experience. For me having a sliding volume control or a screen lock option does nothing for my user experience and that seems to apply to many users.

There is a very good thread currently active where people are suggesting features where the user experience could be improved for them. And giving suggestions to generally improve the app, much like you will find on the Sonos or Roon Forums.

Like most things in life, this is actually more about the user than the app.

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96

Janky means, ‘extremely unreliable quality’.

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The Google Play Store has around 1700 reviews for the Naim app with an average rating of 2.6, that’s really low.

Apparently it’s not just the 20-30 users who are participating in the thread here.

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98

Yes, I understand there are people that complain about the app and I don’t think the app is brilliant. Your graph whilst vaguely useful, does not illustrate lots of other reasons why someone might complain about the app.

My point is that, moaning about parts of the app that don’t quite meet the users needs, is not sufficient evidence to say it’s of extremely unreliable quality.

On a technical level, local WiFi permitting, the app does what it’s designed to do, find and play music. 100% of the time, show album art and give information about the artist. Comparing it to Roon is simply unrealistic. Why are people comparing it to Roon anyway, do Roon make HiFi equipment too?

How much an individual would like to imbue additional aspects to the app is up to them and is certainly not necessarily to do with the app.

I think this is quite an important distinction, especially when people express certain broad terms and statements we see on this thread.

99

Janky for me then.
I will give my old Qute2 screen + remote a 4, the Android App a 2.
Don´t care about Roon or other software, I only want to play Tidal, iRadio, NAS music and FM on my Qute2 or NDX2.
And why not a Windows App ? I´m writing this in my laptop, in front of NDX2, when the music stops, I have to find my phone to play another…

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I suggest that you visit the app page in the Google or Apple store and read the comments there.

Edit: As posted by litemotiv, but you should take a look at that people actually write, not just the poor stars.

And:

It may be that this is what the app was designed to do, but then the design is insufficient for many use cases.

For example, it is only true that the app always finds music for a certain definition of “find”. As was posted above, whether it finds it depends on where the music is stored. Using the general search does not find it if the music is on a UPnP server. It may not matter to you, but it does to others.

It does show album art for me 100% of the time, but unfortunately it shows lots of albums duplicated.

On Android, it does not have the Rovi information about artists, etc., that it does on iOS.

Comparing it to Roon is simply unrealistic. Why are people comparing it to Roon anyway, do Roon make HiFi equipment too?

In my case, I only researched and found Roon because the app was close to unusable for me. This was eventually traced to having 2000 Qobuz favorites, as I already mentioned above. Which seems frankly ridiculous.

And now I have Roon, I think that it is close to how it should be, despite some shortcomings. If Naim had offered me something similar, a server for 1600 euros (I went a bit OTT with the Roon Core :smiley: ) and a software license for 600 (lifetime) with comparable quality, I would have purchased it from Naim

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Apparently, it’s a piece of crap and much better than Sonos…all at the same time.

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