I have no dropout issues when I use AirPlay from my iPhone to Tidal to play music on my Naim muso or when I listen to the internet radio on my muso using the Naim app. The problem seems to be the size of the file from Tidal to Naim when using wifi or even an Ethernet connection to the muso.
It’s not looking good - I’ve contacted Naim once again asking where things are at/what now given that the 4.7 update hasn’t done anything. I must admit that I enquired about a refund on my NDS given that it is still well under warranty and now doesn’t do what is supposed to, and, what I primarily purchased it for - using TIDAL ‘hi-res’. Didn’t pay 30k for nds/555 for it not to work. They have advised that naim and tidal honestly don’t know what the problem is and have no fix on the way. I haven’t read the email for a couple of days now and can’t remember the specifics, but they also said that they’re wanting affected users to get involved with them to use some third party software to help diagnose tidal speeds or something. This issue is just getting ridiculous now. Off to talk to my dealer about money back, as advised by Naim. Perhaps we all should be talking about a refund…???
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That doesn’t sound good, the issue is pretty wide spread now. To be clear, the problem is with the older streamers, my Nova streams Tidal Hi Fi fine. My UQ2 was purchased new pre Tidal function and my Uniti2 is second hand, neither will stream Tidal Hi Fi directly. I’m using a workaround with 3rd generation Apple TVs connected via optical outs, works fine but with reduced SQ. I can accept that my UQ2 was bought before the Tidal function, but I bought a second hand Uniti2 for that functionality, so it’s frustraiting.
There is clearly some change in Tidals streaming that has exposed the vulnerability in the buffer limitations of the old streamers. Not good news for those who brought older streamers for Tidal functionality. And worse for the N272, which is still being sold. I’ve now ruled out an N272 for this very reason.
This all sounds to me like poor connectivity somewhere on the chain. If the streamer is connected by a lan cable direct to the router and there are still dropouts then it’s the internet. I assume once the queue has been sent to the streamer then the app/phone/tablet is no longer used - correct? So poor wifi to the device running the app can be ruled out. So you can turn the app off once the queue has been sent and the streamer should continue - yes? So if the streamer plays up with direct lan the only thing left is the internet feed. I’ve been in the same boat many years ago with IPTV. My internet speed seemed goo enough but things like iplayer would fail. The cause was an unstable internet feed. The speed wasn’t consistent. Things like normal browsing etc… were fine. Can the Muso sufferers pick the unit up and try it on a different internet connection elsewhere? e.g. work?
Hi solwisesteve - I’m a right technophobe so am confused. How can it be the internet/router etc if my crappy old $300 unit in the garage can use the same tidal subscription without any problem at all (wifi’d v wired for the naim)? I guess I’m missing something, as usual!
Oh, and I love Naim to bits, but if they are still selling N272’s with this known issue (and not advising customers beforehand) then that’s not good - not good at all. Also, where is the information Naim to affected customers??? Why isn’t there something on the website about the issue (and ongoing updates) rather than leaving everyone floundering??
What’s the crappy device in the garage? Playing the same files/format?
Hi guys wondering which countries you guys are from that are experiencing this issue. At Singapore, currently only one ISP out of the others are giving this consistent issue of the drop outs.
Here’s the interesting part, this ISP is a partner with Tidal where they offer lower prices for Tidal with a 12 month contract.
If buffering was an issue, then why do the legacy streamers, like my ND5XS, loads Tidal perfectly fine on the other ISP (those that aren’t partnered with Tidal)? I have a friend with an NDX, flawlessly plays on one of the other ISPs but not the same as mine.
How it works here is basically for most, if not all ISP, we are connected to a fibre distribution point, to an ONT and to a router, receiving an average of 400mbps. I don’t think internet speed here is the issue, what it is, i’m still not too sure as I’m not a networking guy myself. I have been learning loads from this thread to be honest. But these are my findings from the people around me as well as the dealers here.
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So you’re saying using different ISPs changes the issue? Very possible. Different ISPs might well have a different ‘route’ to the tidal servers. In fact changing ISP might well mean a completely different tidal server!
In the past I suffered with appallingly inconsistent internet… this is the IPTV story mentioned before. Internet speed seamed okay but ti was actually fluctuating widely. IPTV simply couldn’t cope… or not reliably anyway. After complaining to the ISP over and over I gave in and changed to a different provider. The change was like night-and-day. The headline speed was the same (pre FTTC days so 5meg) but it was now flat and stable… IPTV started working. The difference was the backbone connectivity was different.
Yes indeed. I heard its a very consistent one.
I am also guessing that since the ISP and Tidal are partners, there is a possibility that they have access to a different server that may be causing an issue. By the way, this has been happening for a month or so already. Still the same ISP that’s causing the problem and other ISPs, none other than the regular “bad internet connection” buffering issues that we face from time to time. That’s when I walk to the router and give it a little smack, on the on/off button of course. Works fine after that.
Can’t conclude anything now in Singapore though. But the findings so far have been very accurate.
It’s some small, plastic JBL thingy. As for playing the same files/formats…ummmm……I just switch it on and it goes. I’m very good at jigsaws, mind.
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My issues started about 3 weeks ago in New Zealand, with others here reporting the same. I haven’t changed ISPs. Works fine with a third generation Apple TV which has inbuilt buffering, works with Nova, fails with UQ2 and Uniti2. All wired Ethernet to Spark router.
NZ, Spark provider/router also. No changes, worked flawlessly until 6 weeks ago but odd stuff happening before that. Works fine using the tidal app on ipad (wifi’d) - then bluetoothed to crappy plastic unit.
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Jim UK - have had a 272 wired by ethernet cable, for nearly a year. Have hardly ever had files drop out. I had a time last week where they were dropping out a lot for an hour and also again last night. Last night 4 files downloaded and played fine but then each dropped out after about 20 secs. That feels like a buffering issue. I didn’t time it, but it was a very consistent period of play then sudden stop. I did something else for a couple hours then the 272 worked fine later on.
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It is strange, many of the questions posed in this thread have been answered time and time again on this and the older forum, but I guess few read those previous posts and ask repeatedly the same question.
It is not internet bandwidth related, the first gen streamers are LATENCY sensitive. This is particularly acute with the first gen streamers. Not a real issue with later streamer architecture.
So latency can be affected by your type of broadband, what other traffic is running on your link and ratio of upload to download speeds. The link doesn’t need to be particularly loaded to affect this.
In the past Naim have tweaked the network software in the first gen streamers to minimise the effects of latency, but due to hardware limitations not eliminate entirely. Any issue experienced may be transient or intermittent.
A workaround if unable to upgrade to a new gen streamer is to use a proxy media server like from Bubblesoft… but user experience is affected as a different control app is required. There is hope that Naim may be able to re optimise the first gen firmware.
I have looked at a network trace from a forum member who experienced a glitch. It did not show a latency variation issue, but it did show an oddity where the acknowledgement data being sent back to Tidal was lost. Whether at the users router, broadband, internet or Tidal itself can’t be determined. But it resulted in Tidal resending data so it appeared as duplicate. This shouldn’t be an issue, but may be tripping up the first gen network stack. That log is with Naim. I have no idea whether that is now systemic or relevant.
To analyse this properly then there needs to be some tracing done to see the route the traffic is taking and whether there are any delays on that. There are loads of forum posts out there with tidal drop out issues and typically it comes down to the tidal server and the route to the server. However to do the checking needs some network IT knowledge. There are some tricks you can do on windows to see which server is being used. You can then do some route tracing to see how the traffic is getting from there to you.
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Sorry I think our posts crossed… yes to all of that! 
Yes, well that is fine and dandy, but the reality is, what did work, now doesn’t, and what doesn’t work on expensive Naim streamers works on cheap old generation Apple TVs and random bits of plastic thingies lying around in people’s garages. I can handle work arounds on old Apple TVs etc, but I don’t think this is very good for people buying old streamers, or heaven forbid a new N272, to find it doesn’t actually work as advertised. Can we be certain this won’t start randomly happening on the new streamers?
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Update - this morning Tidal seems to be working fine on my Qb. Last night wasn’t getting beyond 30 seconds!
I set up my ND5XS to play one of Tidal’s playlists - 32 tracks later and it’s still playing. Firmware revision 4.7