In the meantime, the new room could be cleared out and prepared (photo below). My electrician was there a few days ago. An Ethernet connection socket in the room and the laying of a Cat 6 cable to the switch in the garage is possible without any problems. Also dedicated mains for the new room are possible. A separate circuit already exists for the sockets in the new room (see above). He can pull an additional separate line from the main house connection to a new Customer Unit. The existing power lines (6 mm) to the sockets in the room can be attached there. The new CU can be connected separately to the existing house ground. He advised me against replacing the existing power lines (in wall). That would be costly and brings little benefit.
I had suggested a Doepke ground fault circuit interrupter for audiophile applications and a Gigawatt 16 A circuit breaker for the CU (photos below). My electrician said the Doepke could be installed without any problem, with the Gigawatt he would have to check for Swiss approval (the fuse rating would have to be 13 A, not 16 A). And he said there would also be much cheaper all in one solutions with the same specifications as Doepke/Gigawatt.
I will get a detailed offer in the next few days.
Yes PeterR has responed above. I am very happy about any support. I use Vienna Acoustics Haydn Speakers. May be I will upgrade, after the room is ready and room acoustics will be optimized.
In the meantime, I have also received a suggestion for room optimization from Vicoustic. The reverberation time without room treatment is 2.4 sec (at 125 hz) and drops to 0.7 sec (at 4’000 hz). With room treatment it is 0.9 sec (at 125 hz) and drops only slightly to 0.3 sec (at 4’000 hz). Between 250 hz and 4’000 hz it would then be in the normal range between 0.3 sec and 0.6 sec. Space Mooden 1st, 2nd and 3rd category should be able to be contained. The first reflection points, ceiling, side walls and rear wall should be treated, each combined with 8 folding panels VTM and 8 Wavewood ultralight. For the front corners of the room 6 Superbass Extreme bass traps are provided, the rear corners of the room for cost reasons optionally also with 6 Superbass Extreme. Both expert opinions (GIK Acoustics and Vicoustic) agree on the key points of the measures. The materials at Vicoustic and the mounting partly with separate frames are very high quality. However, they are much more expensive than GIK Acoustics.
Next week as a frist step in realisation the electrician will come and do the installation (Ethernet, dedicated mains see above).
my electrician moved the Furutech wall socket from the living room and installed dedicated mains. The power supply now runs separately from the main distribution board to the sub-distribution board (fuse box) with separate grounding. He installed a Doepke DFS 2 audio RCCB Type F. Unfortunately a Gigawatt G16A was not possible because I need 13A. So a good standard circuit breaker was installed.
also my electrician installed an Ethernet wall outlet in the listening room and a Cat6a U/UFTP cable to the Cisco 3560 in the garage.
I bought a used Naim Fraim Lite. Unfortunately, no used Full Fraim was available within acceptable distance. However, I installed a tempered glass plate with silicone nitride ball bearings and brass chips on the top level (following @Xanthe approach here on the forum). I still plan to buy Fraim Chips under the floor spikes.
The system was moved from the living room to the new listening room yesterday. Everything is still provisional. I still need to optimize the speaker position and determine the frist reflection points. After the summer vacations (in 3 weeks) I plan to order room acoustics elements from GIK. The cabling is also still provisional (the Ethernet cable from the wall socket is too short, the power cable a bit too long…).
But overall it already sounds quite good. However, the reverberation time is still too high at 1.2 seconds.
Thanks to all who have supported me so far, especially to @feeling_zen@Mr.M@Simon-in-Suffolk@PeterR@HappyListener, for your technical input.
After my holidays, I have now adjusted the placement of the speakers. The preferred position (measured from the tweeter at the front of the speakers) is 75 cm from the side walls and 140 cm from the wall behind the speakers. The listening position is 290 from the wall behind the speakers and 220 cm from the rear wall. The frist reflection points are still in front of the entrance door on one side wall and the window on the other side wall. This should make room treatment easier.
The differences with different speaker positions were immense. In particular, the soundstage is much deeper and the localisation much better than when the speakers are placed close to the wall.
I watched a few videos on YouTube about speaker placement. The video by “A british audiophile” helped me the most. I hope to order the room acoustics elements next week. The reverberation time is still too high.
Good stuff @Wilfried — it’s all about experimentation. My 'speakers are ~2.25M (to baffle) from my rear wall/glass windows and it really helps to have them forward IMHO, to increase ‘rear depth soundstage’. Of course, this is not very liveable for many people.
Thanks for the ‘link’ to the YT video on speaker placement. I have experimented today with his recommendations in my small room (3.4m x 4.7m) - what a difference it has made. Really chuffed with the results.
I have also made this experience. Speaker positioning is essential for sound quality. Depending on the size of the living room, it can be helpful not to start with the back wall, but to place the speakers to the left and right of the listening position. Then they can be moved in small steps towards the back wall until the optimum distance is found. In most cases, it will be a clear distance from the back wall. This is a decisive advantage of a dedicated listening room, to be able to experiment freely here. In pure living rooms, this is often not possible.
GIK Acoustic Elements are on order now. I will get them at the end of August. I will report, as far as they are installed. I am excited.
Meanwhile I have added Fraim Chips under the Fraim Lite - they bring a little improvement in sound quality. I have ordered them from England and they arrived within one week here in Switzerland.
This week many boxes arrived from GIK Acoustics. Over the weekend I installed them. All four corners of the room now have TripTraps with scatter plates for absorption and diffusion (2 per corner). On the right front, one TripTrap is a little shorter and they are on stands so that the power and ethernet connections remain available. On the back wall I have 2 Immersion Panels also for absorption and diffusion. They look nicer than the standard panels, are much better made, but also cost more than standard panels. For the early-reflection points on the side walls, I use free-standing panels to keep windows and doors clear if necessary. For the floor, I have a deep pile carpet. Unfortunately, it is a bit too big, so I will eventually exchange it for a smaller and lower pile carpet. Maybe the high pile carpet also absorbs too much. I still have to try that out. And the two panels I have not yet installed on the ceiling. I hesitate to do that yet. They are quite heavy after all and the ceiling is just a suspended thin plasterboard. GIK Acoustics said that this is not a problem. But I want to avoid damage to the plaster ceiling. Instead, I tried the panels in the window at the front. This brings an immediately audible improvement. One panel seems almost better than two to me. Two may already be too much absorption.
How does it sound now: it is a very big step forward. Much more details are audible. The soundstage is wider, deeper and the localization of instruments is much better. The bass is tighter and there are no more boomy effects. My son and his girlfriend were here today and they were pleasantly surprised how good the system sounds now. And that although the core component still is only a Uniti Atom.
Overall, I am also very satisfied. The music involves me much more and it’s fun to listen closely.
The advice from GIK Acoustics was competent and the predictions came true. RTF is now reduced from 1.1 seconds to 0.65 seconds (but measured only with an app on the Ipad). However, it is also an intervention in the room. Acoustic elements already dominate very strongly. This is a very strong intervention for living rooms. However, it is not a problem in a dedicated listening room. And it is also an investment. 2.8k for all parts including transport, VAT (Switzerland) and customs duties. But ordering, shipping and delivery went smoothly and in the agreed timeframe.
The listening room is now technically ready. I still have to hang up a few pictures (see below). There will also be adjustments to the cabling (cable dressing). Overall, I am very happy with the result. It is a big improvement in sound quality compared to the situation before, when the system was still in the living room. Dedicated mains were a big step forward. In particular, the annoying fluctuations in sound quality between days have almost completely disappeared. I can confirm that Uniti devices (including my Atom) are very sensitive here. Good power cables and dedicated mains help a lot and raise the sound to a new level. Less noise, wider stage, higher resolution. This also applies to the room acoustics elements. I followed the recommendations of GIK Acoustics and it was really worth it. More bass precision, more detail resolution and a calmer sound image were the result. A big advantage of a dedicated listening room is the ability to place speakers optimally without compromise. This is a key requirement for good sound. Everything fits together much better now. Now I will be able to enjoy the daily hours in the evening (after work) and at the weekend even more. It’s amazing what an entry-level system can do when the framework is right (speaker positioning, power supply, network, rack/set-up, room acoustics). The infrastructure I have is mostly mid-range, no extreme high-end components (devices, switches, cables, etc.). I have also bought a lot second hand. A lot can be achieved here even with a limited budget.
Thanks again to everyone who has supported me with tips and advice from their experience. Without the help of the forum members, I would never have got this far.
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